New Discus Tank

[aks]

Hi everyone, I am starting a new discus aquarium. Please help me out
in a few things

1-Exact dmensions
length 122cm
width 46cm
height 61cm

2-First of all decoration tell me live pants or artifitial.

3-Should i use stones and wood. If i use wood can i use Bogwood?

4-About filtration should i use power filter and undergravel filter? I
know i should go with an external canister filter but i think i might
not have enough funds available for another two months.So any thing
that can work for couple of months.

5-And how to mature the water someone told me to put a piece a meat in
it to rot.should I?

6-thirdly about lighting what i have available here are 40W 4 feet
long flourecent lamps,energy savers,what power to use as not to
disturb discus as they have sensitive eyes, and keep plants alive if
you suggest live,plantation.

7-Ok gravel how much thick the gravel layer should be?

8-Nitrosomonas bacteria how to produce these easily if you guys refers to any liquid medicine hard to find here..incase you guys dont know anything about this please consult this link http://rockymountaindiscus.com/Discus_Fish_Nitrification.htm

i live in Pakistan and we dont much variety of medication here for growing bacteria or something like that...

***I know a few of you might suggest bare bottom tanks but i like plantation and discuss equally so i would rather combine both


I will bother you guys again if i need help again bare me for a few days and thanks for all your help :)

Aks

[Nathan]

id be waiting before you have enough money to start the whole tank, otherwise things can get complicated and will mosyt likely end up in deaths of discus an costing you even more money, id be waiting until u can afford an external cannister filter.

live plants will cost you more money again an can be quite hard keeping a planted tank especially with the water temp so high.

HTH

[FishLover]

2. I would go with plastic plants

3-Bogwood is perfect fot Discus

4-no undergravel filter, I would wait for the cannister filter if possible

5- how to mature the water. One cocktail shirmp (dead or raw) would do the job. Just watch the ammo and nitrite level to be sure the cycle is completed/ Remember, it may take few weeks to do the job.

6-If you don't use live plants, 40w should be fine

7-I would be very careful with the gravel. Make sure it is inert so it does not change your pH level

8-Nitrosomonas bacteria. It is everywhere in the water. The problem is having enough of them in your tank. That's why you mature your tank, or cycle your tank.

You did not say about heater, you need that in your tank to keep about 28C to 30C for the discus.

Watch your pH level and do regular W/C at least one or two times a week. Some people do daily W/C.

[aks]

thanks for help everyone but here it goes l

ive plants i can afford they dont cost much here...

i will buy a canister filter within a month of initial setup and discus will not be introduced by then.

ph levels i know discus like slightely acidic water and as for temp 9 outta 12 month in year we have a temperature of 26-30 so i can easily maintain 30.

now i think i will approach this differently canister filter will be available no worry about that but for the first month i want to plant live plants lighting help is appreciated i can use halogens?

i want plants to settle mature the water and then introduc discus

hope i am planning it right and funds arent too much problemthey aint scarce but they arent unlimited either :).

Natural plants are not expensive here....(those that are available)

***To all members i bilieve this may be a hectic answering so much questions but i am starting a new tank i will go all the way with a little guidence***

[Merrilyn]

Welcome to the forum AKS. Very pleased to see you are asking questions before you purchase your first discus.

The way you run your tank will depend on a few things. What's the pH of your water, and are you able to do frequent water changes, like could you manage 25% three times a week, or could you only manage 50% once a week or maybe twice a week.

Discus are not really difficult fish to keep, but they do have certain demands to remain happy and healthy.

As you are new to fish, I'm going to suggest to you a method that is almost failsafe.

First, your tank is fine for up to 6 fish. I'd buy them all at once and let them grow up together. If you only intend getting 3 or so fish, then once again, buy them all together and all the same size. Two fish on their own usually end up with one being bullied. Three or more is better.

To begin use a bare bottom tank. Discus like their tanks kept very clean, and having the tank bare you will see just when you need to clean. Now, just because you don't have gravel doesn't mean you can't have plants. Alot of plants can be grown on bogwood and have a very beautiful effect. You may also like to grow one or two large plant in pots with gravel. Amazon sword plants are ideal for this and can look wonderful.

When you have successfully kept your discus for about 6 months, then begin adding gravel and plants if you wish.

There is lots of information on cycling your tank on this forum. Just be sure you get some good test kits, and follow the cycle progress carefully. It can take up to 6 weeks to fully mature your tank and filter, before you can add fish.

As far as filters go, with such a big tank, a cannister filter would be best, but if you have a good strong air pump, you could run the tank on sponge filters alone. All your filter is, is a home for your nitrifying bacteria. They need somewhere to colonize, with good water flow and adequate oxygen. Three fairly large sponge filters would do a very effective job on a tank that size (I've done it) especially if you begin with a bare bottom tank, and you're able to do frequent water changes.

Good luck, and keep asking questions.

Lots of friendly and experienced discus keepers here willing to offer you advice.

[samir]

9 outta 12 month in year we have a temperature of 26-30 so i can easily maintain 30.
Aks where in Pak are you ??? you will need something for May, June and July when the temp will most likely hit 45. I kept them in India and the water from our house tank would sometimes come out at close to 50 degrees . you can use a top filter for your tank. you also have to be prepared for power outages (depending on which city you live) i lost 8 out of 10 of my discus to power outages back then. if you dont have any experience with fish keeping i suggest keeping some inexpensive tropical fish for a few months. also you will need to test your water for hardness and chlorine. in our part of the world they use a hell of a lot of chlorine. maybe water from a "handpump" or "tubewell" will be better.

[aks]

Thanks Merrilyn (hopefully got the name right)

Water changes arent a problem this is not my first tank and i give 2 hours a day to my fish i also watch them while studying so that makes around 10 hours a day lol...

I know PH requirement monitaring ammonia and nitrates i will take care of that i have a reverse osmosis filter in my kitchen i will fill tank up using that if you think thats Ok?....Water at room temperature is around 28 Celcius so that will help as well...

In a canister filter there are three portions tell me which material to fill which portion and what should be the filtration rate.

And i know bare bottom tank do well for beginners but i am really stuborn on using gravel sorry about that...lol


***I am gonna give my fish utmost care as i have been doing for all my fish***

[samir]

only use half RO water, dont fill only with that. you need RO water only if you tap water is hard.

[aks]

Dear Samir,

Thanks for the advice man yes i have battery charged pump for that secondly in my residence power outages are no more than one hour. For heat i have 24 hrs of air conditionng on in those three month maintaing a temperature of 27 ceclius while my aquarium heaters are adjusted for the nominal temperature for the fish...

***I have 2 tanks already and have succesfully kept chiclids,angels,catfish,goldfish and in this hobby i have been for around 7 years.***

[Merrilyn]

HaHa, that's okay. If you want gravel, then use it. We can work around it. :lol:

Start with around an inch of gravel in your tank at the front, and have the back a bit deeper for plants. Make sure you leave lots of 'swimming room' with plenty of open spaces at the front of the tank. Try just a few plants to begin, and then later you can add some more.

Cleaning is a bit more difficult with gravel, so invest in a good gravel vac, and be sure to use it weekly.

Welcome to the wonderful world of discus.

Looks like the discus bug has bitten you hard :lol:

[samir]

you should be fine then, good luck and send us a few kilos of generic Metro :wink:

[aks]

Dear Samir

Thanks man will fill tank 50% with RO water and yes water is hard here.
By the way Lahore, Punjab is my location.

Dear Merrilyn,

I have saved for a Fender Strat(a guitar) for three months but for this project i dont care about that guitar so much...I want discus and me i am a petfreak...I have cats, birds,fishes, soon i will have a poodle and i want discuss bad...

And lighting?
We have halogens flourecent rods and energy savers.What to use for plant growth and avoid disturbing discuss

[aks]

ok here is a gravel i am gonna use any suggestions before i go on cleaning it lol

No sand because its fine and plants sometimes get pulled up by water pressure...

[aks]

Hello i have just found that i have a water filter installed in my kitchen which has three segments of cleaning water one portion has sponge like stuff which cleans dirt and other residuals etc second has activated carbon and third has a UV sterilizer any ways i can use that to my advantage?

[aks]

hello everyone...

here is the bogwood and it hasnot been in water yet how should i clean it?
boil it?? scrub it??

***never mind my cat***

[Nathan]

you should give a bit of a scrub then soak it for a couple weeks if u dont want tannins leeching into your water, but if u dnt wish to wait that long, boil it because the water will sterlise some of it aswel as help it sink

[Telperion]

you should give a bit of a scrub then soak it for a couple weeks if u dont want tannins leeching into your water, but if u dnt wish to wait that long, boil it because the water will sterlise some of it aswel as help it sink

will boiling it get the tannins out faster?

[Peaches]

We soaked our bogwood in extremely hot water for two weeks. Since putting it into the tank we haven't had a problem. Both our pieces were too big to boil so this worked well for us.

Good luck...I was bit by the Discus bug around 9 months ago and it's been a ride ever since:)

[aks]

i have three very nice shaped pieces which are not too big but i can boil them and will do.

[Nathan]

i think it does help remove tannins a bit faster, but if u reallt want to get rid of them the only way is to soak them for a couple weeks

[goldenpigeon]

2. live or artificial? what do you like? if you have live plants your probably going to want to invest in a fertalised substrate (can mix half fert substrate with standard gravel to lower the cost but you wont get as thick growth). you would want good lighting and possibly something in the way of co2 for live plants.

artificial plants look absolutally CRAP in my oppinion. nothing like a bit of plastic in your fish tank is there? :) hehe sorry, its up to you, your tank not mine so you do it how u like.


3. stones and wood are fine. bogwood is fine. with the stones just make sure they wont affect your ph or hardness. you can test your rocks by pouring vinegar over the rocks and if it fizzes then they are not safe to use in your discus tank. rocks should not be obtained from creek areas because you never know what chemicals could be in the water.

wood... give it a good scrub, if you can fit it in a pot to boil it then do that, if its larger stick it in your bath tub and boil some water to pour over it and give it a good scrub. try and soak it for a few days then give it another scrub and it will be ready.

4. your discus wont like too much current but they dont need still water. one of my tanks has so much filtration in it that when new fish come into the tank that arent used to it get blown around a bit. my fish have learned to deal with it well but i cut the current down a lot, there is just a lot of surface movement.

you wont want to have bvery much current to start with which the power filter will make a lot of. im not a fan of the power filters because all they are good for is blowing the water arround. they hold very little bio media and so generally arent of much use in a discus tank.

undergravel filters in my oppinion are the filters from h ell. run an undergravel filter for a month and then lift up the grate and check out all the build up under it, makes you sick to think your fish were in with that. in my oppinion you dont want all that crap breaking down and degrading under your substrate and the filter grate. not a good option in my oppinion because discus produce a lot of waste and these things will cause problems for you, which ofcourse you dont want.

i think it would be best to wait (i know its hard) for the 2 months or so and get a filter that suits your tank/fishes needs perfectly. then you dont need to worry about it and you wont come across all the problems in the process.


5. you arent so much maturing the water but trying to seed the filter with the good bacteria which make the waste the fish produce unharmful. its best to use pure ammonia to get the process going. or you could use some hardy fish to get the process going. the only problem with using fish to do the work for you is that there is a possiblility they will bring disease into the tank. there are some good threads on cycling filters on the forum, check them out.


6. im not very good on the lighting subject (im still learning about lighting) but you would want atleast 2 watts per gallon (4 liters of water) to keep your plants alive. this will be ok with the discus because it isnt overly bright. you will probably find that some discus dont like strong light... others dont care. i tend to think that a healthy discus wont really care about too much light where as a sick or unconditioned discus will not like the light to much. try to get 2 watts per gallon at least thoagh. this will also depend on plant density.

if you dont know how to find the volume of your tank here is how you do it: [this has to be done using centimeters for the rule to apply]

Length [122cm] X Width (or Depth) [46cm] X Height [61cm] divided by 1000

so:

122 X 46 X 61 divided by 1000 = 342.332L (total volume of tank, remember the water level will be slightly lower than top of tank or water spills out lol)

so take about 10 liters off for water level -

332.5L divided by 4 (trying to get gallons) = 83.5 gallons

so you want about 2 watts per gallon = 167 watts of lighting (remember you want atleast this for your plants).


7. gravel should be (for plants) 3-5cm thick at the front and at least 8cm high at the back. this is assuming you have stem plants or large plants with large root systems at the back and smaller foreground plants at the front.

hope this helps.

cheers
David

[aks]

hey david thanks for your time....

-Well no worries about canister filter i purchased it...
-i hate artiftial plants.Amazon swords are easy to find here and very cheap about AUD 0.5 a plant.
-the tank size has increased a little bit as i have changed it at the last moment 4ft length.1.5ft wide and 2 feet high.
-Ok powerfilter and undergravel filter are crossed out.
-how about using some hardy fish from a healthy tank.

CO2 injection can be ordered but it doesnt seem i can find it in ay fish store.

Any other suggestion on quantity of fish and filter media as my canister filter has 3 portions.

[goldenpigeon]

if you have healthy fish from another tank then you can use them to cycle the filter for sure.

discus - general rule is 1 adult discus to 40L of water. smaller fish can be in greater numbers ofcourse, trial and error a bit here, just use your judgement.

if co2 is a cheap enough option for you then i would recommend it, it will keep your plants healthy and allow you to control you ph level better.

filter media - what brands do you have available? probably seachem would be one of your best options..

see how you go

cheers
David

[aks]

Ok good news i am setting up tank all decoration filtration in a couple of days it will be ready for some pictures will keep you guys posted

[nicholas76]

Bio zorb pouch will get rid of tannins!

[aks]

background blue, an underwater scene or none ?

[sammigold]

Its up to you! I like blue backgrounds that I have seen on some tanks.... but then I have seen tanks with underwater scenery and they look ace too!

Go with what you like best....:-)

[aks]

I got 4 pigeon blood today they are around 2 inch...hopefully they survive not eating anything yet..i am trying tetra bits

[Merrilyn]

It may take them a little while to settle in, but in the meantime, can you ask the breeder or shop what they had been used to eating in the past.

[samir]

try frozen bloodworms, aur kuch photo dikhao

[aks]

i tried tetra bits they comeout and roam around when lights are off but hide when they are turned on they have been here for 2 days only

[nicholas76]

live brime always works for me

[sammigold]

Im sure you meant "Brine" shrimp, Nic. LOL

also a school of some dither fish may help them feel safer if after a couple of weeks you still find they are hiding. ie. cardinal tetras or rummy nose or similar...

glad to see you finally got your discus.. cant wait to see pics!

[nicholas76]

ummm yeah ooops,,,, thanx lol


I find it really interesting when people struggle with new discus. I mostly havent really experienced it.

Its usually a water issue, shadows, lights or too much initial activity near the tank I find that tends to spook them.

[aks]

Ok good news they are alot more comortable now they are running up and down on front glass...they are not at all shy. They are eating but not initially when i put the food in they take like 5 mins to know that food is in and they start eating from the bottom.And all their elegant movemment is really keeping me happy.I hope they stay the same i have 30 plants sheltring them, tank mates are neon tetra and some other tetra's i am not sure of the species.

[aks]

ok i have noticed one thing my Co2 outlet throws a water current its not strong but all four are running against the current its on one side of aquarium is that OK?

[aks]

Some pictures of my aquarium...