Water PH level

[FishLover]

I have a 125 G tank with 6 young discus (about 3 inch each) in it. There are few neon tetras, few ottos and few corys as tankmates. It has some plants in it too. I change about 40% of water twice a week. I also have two pieces of driftwood in the tank. I use a small amount of peat in the filter too. I keep my tank at 88F and no ammo found in the tank. I also use an air pump to pump air into the tank at night.

My tap water PH is 7.6 when it comes out of the tap, it goes to 8.0 after a day. I'm trying to lower the PH level by using peat to treat the water before water change. I use peat in a special filter to treat it in a container, it drops the PH to about 7.0 after about one hour or so. My tank water is about 7.7 so every water change the ph drops to about 7.2, then goes back to 7.6 next day, then goes to 7.7 day after and stays there till my next water change. I changed the gravel in the tank because it was reacting to the acid. I did the acid test with new gravel and it did ot react to the acid. Still, it did not help that much (before that it bounced up to 8.0 the next day)

My question is, how do I avoid the PH swings? How can I keep it lower? Do I need to keep it lower? I don't think RO is my option. Aging water is also not possible. I have a 5 year old at home and having a 44 g container fill with water is not safe for him.

Another question, what keeps my PH up like that? I think I may have hard water from my tap. Never test it.

My discus are doing OK. I have had them for about 2 months now. Lost one few days after delivery and everything looks fine so far. They are not showing the brigh color yet. It could be they are bit young or it could be the PH level. Any idea?

Thanks in advance for the help.

[Merrilyn]

Hello fishlover, welcome to the forum. Glad you could join us.

There are a few things I'd like you to try. First, get a clean glass of water from the tap. Allow it to stand for an hour, and then do a pH test. Test it again after 24 hours, and then again after 48 hours. Don't add anything to the water, no peat or dechlorinator. We need to establish the base water we are working with.

Next, I'd like you to get another clean glass of tap water, but this time add around an inch of gravel to the water. Do the same pH tests, after 24 and 48 hours. This will prove if the gravel is having any affect on your water.

Discus will cope quite happily with a small pH swing, but constant large swings like that are not a good idea.

I've got quite a few more ideas, but let's start with your tap water readings, then we can work out what to do from there. :P

[FishLover]

OK, I will post the test results in two days. Hmmm... Why did I think of that? I guess experts do have their tricks that we average guys don't know.

Thanks and have a Happy New Year!

[FishLover]

OK, Here are the resutls for the PH level:

Tap water without gravel
out of tap 7.60, one hour later 7.71, 24 hours later 8.11, 48 hours 8.08
Tap Water with 1 inch gravel
out of tap 7.0, one hour later 7.72, 24 hours later 8.09, 48 hours later 8.04

I also did some monitor of my last water change. I pre-treated my tap water with peat and it brought down the ph to around 6.5 after 5 hours. (I was doing it for 1 hour previous WC)

The tank water was about 7.6. After water change, it was down to 7.19. I notice whenever I turned on the air pump, the PH level went up right after about 10 minutes. With the air pump turned off, I was able to maintain the ph level around 7.2. Could be that my ph meter is giving me fault readings due to the air pump?

[FishLover]

Tap Water with 1 inch gravel
out of tap 7.60, one hour later 7.72, 24 hours later 8.09, 48 hours later 8.04


Sorry I missed the .6

[FishLover]

Any advise?

[Merrilyn]

Sorry been off duty for a couple of days. Daughter's wedding.

Hmmm you are getting interesting readings, aren't you. The fact that your pH is bouncing up even without any gravel in the glass indicates to me that you may have naturally very hard water.

Filtering through peat will not only drop the pH but it will soften your water too. As aging the water is out of the question for you at this stage, the two suggestions I have are .......... purchase a reverse osmosis unit and use part RO water and part tap water. This will reduce the amount of minerals in your water and help to stabilize your readings.

The other thing, is to keep peat moss in your filter and alter your water change routine from 40% twice a week to about 15% daily. That will reduce the huge changes that happen with big water changes.

The other thihg I would do is leave your air pump on all day and night. It's not affecting your pH. Discus come from water with a high oxygen content, so they love the extra circulation in the tank. And remember that warm water doesn't hold as much oxygen as cooler water, so I run airstones in all my tanks all the time.

Keep us posted on the progress of your tank.

What area do you live in? We may have some other members in your area, who are experiencing the same problems, and may have found a way to over come it.

[FishLover]

Thanks for the advise. Congrats on your daughter's wedding.

I'm doing three things now:
1. I'm use hot water (over 120 F) from my tap. I heard that hot water is a bit softer than cold.
2. I'm now using peat to pre treat my water for about 4 hours before pump it into my tank. I bought a cannister filter just for tha. It is rated at 350 gph, which means for the 40g of water I'm treating, it can have the water pass the peat filter at least 34 times. That allows the temp to drop to about 89 F and keeps the ph in the 6.9 range beofer pumping. My tank water is now about 7.4 so it will be a drop to 7.2+. It goes back to 7.4 after a day or so. It still have some up and downs after water change but within .2 level. I used to treat it only for about 30 minutes and it kind of only brought down the ph level for the short term. Treating it for 4 hours looks like soften the water a bit.
3. I also use airstone while treating the water. I guess 4 hours of it kind of driven the co2 out of the water, which may helped to reduced the ph bounce next day in the tank. I set my filter return water spread bars to hit the surface of the water so I think that gives me enough oxygen in the water.

I'm happy with the 7.4 PH now. Not the under 7 that is best for discus but I think they will do fine. In fact, ever since the ph came dow to around 7.4, my discus look to have better colors.

This is not a cheap nor easy option I would say. Also, I have to keep an eye on the kid for the 4 hours, which is not easy. My wife is going to kill me if I try to do that every day. In fact, I may have to reduce the water change to once every week due to the long period. I can do that on Friday and let the treatment start in the afternoon and change the water late in the night. I'm not sure if my discus like that idea or not. They kind of getting used to the 40% water change every Monday and Friday.

I live in TN, USA and is a region known for hard water because ot the lime stones and rocks.

[FishLover]

Happy to report that my PH is steady at 7.2 now. My discus are happy and showing some good colors. I think hot water and the peat pre-treat of 5 hours did the trick.

Thanks for the help Ladyred. I'm going to do a 40% water changes every 5 days, and maybe later moving to a 40% to 45% water change every week. 5 hours of pre-treat is taking some toll on me. I have to watch the kid all the time to make sure he is not dividing into the container, which can really hurt him (hot and deep water for him is not good :-) ). I wish there is a better way so I can change more water!

[RDavies]

Is it right what you said about water from the hot water heater being softer than cold water? I am a newbie to this and am after ways to keep the water as soft as possible with minimal chemicals

[Mr Wild]

RDavies

Buy a rain water tank and attach it to your gutter....you will have all the soft water you need!

[BigDaddyAdo]

I use a mix of rainwater:tapwater 80:20. Works a treat for me. Constant PH of 6.5.