Wild cichlids

[Squid]

Guy and Girls - you are not gonna believe this. Yesterday, my brother and I went fishing down in the clear dark waters of the Ross river in Townsville and we were having a few beers (as you do) when my brother says - 'hey, there's a gold fish near my hook' . We were fishing with a float which sat around 5 inches under the water due to a small sinker attached. I put my beer down and had a look. What I now own is a 8 inch Red Devil female. Photos to come as soon as I can reduce the photo to less than 128k .I'm not joking either and this is no hoax - but it gets better. I also sighted a large adult male Green terror (Aequidens riviulatus) who would come near the devil. I said to my brother 'catch that mother .#%@$!er' but it was too late, as it took the worm and ran like I've never seen into the weeds. A brilliant fighting fish for sure. It still gets better!! I talked to the ecologist at James Cook Uni, and he is currently studying the rivers eco/bio pollution. THERE ARE WILD DISCUS UP HERE. I now have a new aim in life,; A SPECIMEN MUST BE CAPTURED. I'm going out this afternoon to assemble as many snags/logs in this open shallow area as I can. I'l keep everyone informed as to my progress.

Also - I can capture a fair few of these Devils. Others on my new pricelist from 'Ross river hatcheries' include - get ready - Green Severums, Red terrors, Firemouths, Red jewels, convicts, tilapia (which I kill on sight), Rams (apparently!!) and many more. Some real idiots up here - letting these things go in our waterways. Also, when Townsville got flooded in 98, over 5000 houses went under and many fish tank inmates got released. The photos of the discus the scientist had were greens/royal blue looking and absolutely brilliant.

Am so excited I can hardly think - going back down to the river now!!

[sunshinediscus]

I've heard about the ross river red devils, when i was working for a wholesaler we used to buy many of them for resale. Quite nice looking ones as well. I heard a rumour they were wiped out a few years ago apparently by breeding barramundi but obviously they are back.

Down here in brissy i've caught and/or seen goldfish, carp, gambusia, guppy, swordtail, tilapia, port acara, rosy barb and there is a thriving population of translocated Saratoga.

Rod

[goldenpigeon]

i would like to purchase a couple of those wild caught discus :lol: ....... from australia..... :lol:

that is very interesting !!!!!!!!

[kalebjarrod]

Its very cool in a not very cool way if you understand

Pics?

[Squid]

Pics on the way - just got to get this new photoshop 8 working. You need a degree in computer science just to use it!!

[Squid]

OK- I officially hate computers. I hope this attachment photo works. It was taken about 5 minutes after liberation from the Ross river. More to come. Crap photo - but if you can copy it onto a clipboard and reduce it, it looks OK

[Tryhard]

There was mention of an oscar being caught in the goulburn river in NSW although I am not sure how it survived the low temps in winter.

[Squid]

Saw a school of oscars yesterday - big grey fellas - not tigers thats for sure. Looks like they've reverted to their wild colouration. Fairly heavly poluted up here

[wild_amazon]

Wow this is just amazing :shock:
Squid, can you measure the water temperature and other parameters next time you go there? I can understand some introduced species can thrive in our river system but to have discus in there is simple amazing. Is it possible for some discus to adapt to a lower climate in such a short time? Evolution takes a long time. I don't know anyone that can keep discus for a considerable time in 26C tank and in winter the river probably get quite cold. Too cold even for most tropical fish. Maybe certain part of the river has something that keep the water warm. Like near dams you can get warm water all year round from generators. Or maybe geological influence.
I must say even though it's bad to have these fish in the river system, I get excited when I hear that discus is surviving/thriving in our river(s).
Keep the pictures coming please.

[Mattzilla]

keep us posted on your progress mate


and keep the pics coming

[Squid]

Ok fella's. I went and did some water testing today. Right now outside air temp is 31 deg C (yep its the dry season not winter!). Water pH is 5.7, dGH 2, surface 25deg C, 3 ft depth was 26 deg C (I cant work that out- other than night time water heats loss as it is getting down to around 20C at night) and is high in humic matter. Looks a bit like a tea-tree swamp colour but not as dark. I'll have some photos of the area where we caught the devil and suspected discus areas. Here is a few better shots of the female RD. All the water up here is from the wet tropic rainforest run-off so it can be expected that we'll have good conditions for discus. On the tablelands, my mate pumps straight from the creek for his discus with no heating required or disease problems. Remember, we are a bit closer to the equator then the southern streams region of Amazonia (EG Alenquer/Peru etc) so conditions are right. I just hope the rumors are true and I can land one. The river is weired - so I have 4 separate areas to search with about 15 km of river frontage!!

[wild_amazon]

That is almost perfect condition expect for the temp. I suspect that water temp is quite stable but that depends on how deep the river is.
I read few article about catching discus. The most popular way is by using torch light at night with little dinghy. That can be challenging. Another method is to sink small branches at favorable position. Leave it for a couple of days until it is occupied by discus. Then surround it with net and remove the branches. Tie the bottom part on the net and bring up the catch. You might get few species.

You only need to catch one single discus to prove the story/myth.

I wish I could be there.

PS: don't forget to quarantine your fish. Nice colour and looks healthy.

[goldenpigeon]

THATS AMAZZZZING!!!!!! :shock:

that red devil is a beutiful colour and everythin!

ur lucky mate but its kinda scary when u think about green terrors, RD's and oscars (just to mention a few) are loose in australian water ways........

[Squid]

Yeah - its scary all right. Someone may or may not have released them thought. A big time south american breeder lost 20 4ft tanks full of adults and fry during the Jan98 floods. Over 5000 houses went under so even if 1 in 50 houses had a fish tank, then thats a lot of escapees! Anyway, I've set my trap of logs and dead fall. I'll be netting tonight. I'll try the first weir for a month or so then move onto the other 3 as they currently have my old dry season friend 'Crocodylus esturineus' in them. Crocs go nuder the streets up here in the dry season. At Hermit Park near the river, you can hear them undre ground in the water drains chasing cats!!

[Tryhard]

One thing I did read about Discus collecting is that they like vertical structore for some reason if you have an area full of that style of snag the Discus will probably be there - even berlying up an area constantly for a month may concentrate the fish in one specific area so it is easier for you to net them.

[wild_amazon]

Squid, are you serious about the crocs?

Yes I think discus like vertical structure since they are thin and quite tall.
I wonder if you can make some plastic plants. Basically you cut strips of black plastic bag and put a weight at the bottom like brick etc. I used this myself in my QT tank where I tied some black plastic strips to a small rock. This method was used by a wild discus breeder, I read it on TFH long time ago.
It looks like a tall skinny plants and discus can hide amongst the plastic strips. It's easier to remove.
The problem will be with the plastic strips get washed away and polute the river.

[Trebs]

Everything else aside, a temp of around 25degrees should not be a problem. I kept my first batch of Turks at around 25-26degrees for the majority of their first year and they were fine. Discus can handle lower temps as long as water conditions are good and parasities/diseases are not present.

[Squid]

Crocs are bad here, but not as bad as Darwin where you can wake up and actually find one in your swimming pool!! Townsville city council just released a croc alert in last weeks paper. Big fellas spotted in the Houghton river (10kms South) and some in the salt water section of the Ross rvr. No one seems to get chewed on though.

[Ben]

This is only a silly thought but would it be possible in far north to have a small dam with Amazonian water conditions, throw in a dozen or so discus and see what happens in 2 years?

mmm....

[goldenpigeon]

could do but i would cost a far bit i would think. in darwin it can get freezing nights

[wild_amazon]

Squid, any luck with catching discus or other fish?

[Vip]

Hi guys,

I would hate to put a downer on everyone but these fish are not wild Red Devils, nor are they F1, and for that they wouldnt even be real Red Devils. I bet 100% there parents are still the hybrids we see in our LFS's and were aquarium born and raised. So far as far as I know theres only a handful of people who own Red Devils in Australia, I myself own 2 that were labelled RD's but they are not as they are a hybrid of Red Devils and Midas cichlids, no one really owns a real RD, I only know one person and they payed well over $600 for it :)
IMO, these fish should be removed from our lakes as it isnt right for them to be in there.

[Merrilyn]

Hi Vip, welcome to the forum. Thanks for that info. Now I confess I don't know a lot about red devils, but why would they cross breed them with a Midas cichlid. Are they too difficult to breed pure?

I agree, they shouldn't be in our lakes at all, but the problem now is how to get rid of them.

[Vip]

If it was hard then it would be easy :( its impossible LOL, 80% of the time the male kills the female due to him being to agressive when the young come along.

Why they were crossbred? To make them larger and also a new stain of fish that is more aprealing to the customer, Red Devils and Midas are from the same family but are in fact differnt fish, the Red Devil hits a max size of 11" where the midas gets to about 15" the RD has fat lips and a long snout where the Midas doesnt, even in the USA all there stores of full of midas/red devil hybrids whitch alot of people are sick of seeing as they pay money for a fish that is labelled wrong, there getting ripped off. When ever someone asks me a question if its real or not i just say to them if you didnt get it from a good dealer and just went tp a LFS then you can bet its not pure.

here is a Midas

[Vip]

here is a Red Devil. they both come in orange and also light orange.

[Vip]

Barred Midas

[Vip]

Barred Red Devil.

[Vip]

Hybrid Of Red Devil X Midas

This is my fish, as he is a Hybrid but seems to be more red devil than Midas, but he is still a hybrid. Its is impossible to keep 2 red devils in the same tank under 200g

[Squid]

VIP you are dead right. Red devil is a trade name for something we have in Australia. A bit like C. nigrofaciatium X sprilium. Crap fish are everywhere. Very few people own real red devils. I had a pair of C. labatiums (red fish with real bug lips) and they were rare also. They were really red - not dark orange. Those were wild caught as were my original red devils. I got them in as part of my research project in 1990 and we imported about 100 juv's and only 3 made it to adulthood due fighting. The specimens we see in shops these days are all hybrids I reckon. My Labatium juv's sold for around $50 per fish back in 1985!! and I haven't seen them for a while. I sold the pair to a guy named Shaun Grosskopf (just in case anyone knows him). I have caught more of these red devil hybrids in the Townsville river systems. Now I have photos of the wild caught discus up here so stand by!! They are real yellow looking- a bit like a green

[novafishy]

hey Squid, how's the discus fishing coming along? where are the pics?

[DiscusMad]

there was a report on the local news in Kempsey my mother was telling me that they found a dam with discus that they belived to have been living there for a few years and the council had netted them and destroyed the fish in fear of them ettin into the river.

[DR.V]

Barred Midas look like frontosa dont you think ???

[Merrilyn]

The colouring is similar, but the shape is very different. This is my young Burundi 6 Bar Frontosa.

[kalebjarrod]

ohhhhhhhhhhh nice fron'y

can he join mine :wink:

[wyldchyld01]

After this inspiring (tragic email of introduced wild fish in our waterways sorry) tale of free fishies thought i'd go and look around locally,

not as warm as fnq but still, have found a huge colony of jack demsey's (taken over a creek pretty much, and not much else survives) and some other more cold water fish like bitterlings etc. water was pretty cold off the mountains considering coffs is usually considered sub tropical

would kill for a dam full of discus if i lived in queesland sigh

may i point out that removing things other than introduced species can get you into trouble if your not careful or allowed to in your state, and we don't promote the wrong things do we lol

Brenton

[Merrilyn]

ohhhhhhhhhhh nice fron'y

can he join mine :wink:

Well you may not want to after you learn his name. 8-)

That looks like a nice little female frontosa you got there.

Ryan, meet Andy Bear :wink:

[Officerlungy]

Yes Ryan ,
Nice lil gurl you got there , I Think you'll find that "Andy Bear"
would like to make a "Women" out of her ... 8-)

Andy Bear .

[kalebjarrod]

LOL

i like my little lady

and most the lady's like me :wink:

[Matthew]

KBJ, Im a male and I like you :p

-Matt

[Bronx19]

Kale, what are you using for teh substrate?

[kalebjarrod]

Im a male and I like you :p

debateable LOL not sure which part :?


Kale, what are you using for teh substrate?

pool filter sand, white and shiny

[tara]

I thought people might be interested about wild red devils. I live in vic, I live near power stations and the have a cooling pond called Hazelwood Pondage temps are pretty high around 27deg. Apperently fish owner in Melbourne make special trips to catch red devils.