Woes of the Newbie

[Benny]

*frantically rips hair from head*

I was doing a lot of reading prior to joining your forums, especially on gill flukes.. I have been worried that 2 of my 3 discus were infected with these (were showing the symtoms of very fast breathing, around 120 times a minute)... I saw the second symptom a short while ago, my beautiful blue diamond is breathing out of only one gill :(

Does this mean the flukes are very advanced, or what?

My tank is 157L, could someone PLEASE advise me on what is the best med to use, and dosages that seem most effective?

Also i noticed on one of the discus it had a fairly long poo (2" long or so) and about the 1st cm was a whitish colour, then the rest was the usual reddish colour.. Do i need to start worrying that my fish have hex too? It was a once off, and havent noticed any white faeces on any of the other two discus..

Discus arent easy to keep,
Blimey! :? :shock: :( :roll: :?: :wink:

[Merrilyn]

Okay Benny. Take a deep breath. Discus are tough little cookies. It takes a lot to kill them, and a few gill flukes arent going to do that.

Now the medication you need is Praziquantal which is found in your fish shop, under a lot of brand names. It treats gill flukes and tape worm, which are the two most common ailments our fish get. Follow the directions exactly, and you should be fine.

In answer to your second question, No you fish does not sound like it has hex.

Now relax, and enjoy your fish.

[Benny]

RELAX?

Hahahahahahahah easier said then done, my dear friend...

Thanky for your advice, do you ever do such things as double doses etc? just wanna know the best practise for applyin prazi? Is there a preffered brand? i want nothing but the best...

Contemplating establishing another tank as a quarantine / med tank... Thinking that a 2 footer may be a good start im not sure? whats the best way to get it started (cycling)? When i take water out of the main tank for a WC should i put it in the new tank to get some bacteria happening (i have a damn large bottle of stresszyme which should also get the ball rolling..

I tell you i am the most highly strung teenager you will ever meet...! neurotic and then some!!

I LOVE THIS WEBSITE!!!

oh and one other point of interest, is it unsafe to add new fish to a tank being treated with prazi (im sure new fish could use a de-worming too)

[Merrilyn]

I like Aqua Master Gill Fluke and Tape Worm Tablets. Always seem to do the trick for me.

Now if you hang around here long enough, you will hear me preach about quarantine for any new additions before they go in your discus tank.

It is an absolute must. No if's or maybe's. It is a must.

Nothing, not even a neon tetra should go in your tank without going through 4 weeks of quarantine.

Now 2 foot will be fine as a quarantine tank. As far as cycling goes, I would just hang a sponge filter in my existing tank, where it will cycle naturally, and then when you need it, it will be ready to pop into the quarantine tank. Simply fill your Q tank with clean, de-chlorinated water, and add your now cycled sponge and you are ready for fish.

While your fish are in the Q tank, observe them for signs of gill flukes or any other symptoms, and treat if required.

[mistakes r crucial]

Benny,

Pulling your hair out is fine, by the time you've had Discus 12 months you wont have anymore to pull out so the pain goes relatively quickly lol!!

[Benny]

Lol baldness @ 19... Somethin to look forward to hehehe

[chris]

Its all learning Benny, if you have this problem again youll be a master, then you can help people on this forum. Good luck :wink:
keep us posted :!:

[Benny]

Looking @ the blue diamond this morning, hes breathing at a relatively normal pace out of both gills? what gives :?

Could it have been that perhaps last night when he was breathing out of only one of his gills, that he was scared?

[Benny]

Ok i have purchased the Prazi tablets, theyre pretty darn expensive!

It says after 48 hours to clean filter media.. Errr id normally wash it in tank water, but wont the tank water also have the medication in it? Whats the usual procedure of filter cleaning with prazi?

Thnx guys,
i love the forum

[Merrilyn]

Wash the filter as you normally do, in tank water.

I think the reason for washing the filter is to remove any of the white powder that is used as a filler in these tablets.

[Benny]

Just did the 48 hours post treatment WC and filter clean, the discus all seem ALOT happier then before, the breathing seems more normal, and they are swimming around alot scavenging for food..!

Happy camper, is i :) :wink: :lol:

[ctvu]

Hi Benny

Glad to hear they are recovering well.
Once again credit to LR.
Pls check your PM Merrilyn.

ctvu

[Benny]

One question...
I know white droppings are a sign of hex, but if a fish is otherwise healthy lookin, swims around, eats etc can it still be hex?


Thanks guys
Benny :)

[Merrilyn]

Yes it can Benny. It just means it is in the early stages. Later on the fish shows other signs, like darkening, refusing food, wasting away, hiding etc.

[ctvu]

Yes it can Benny. It just means it is in the early stages. Later on the fish shows other signs, like darkening, refusing food, wasting away, hiding etc.

Yes LR is quite right. Because it is happening to one of my fish.

ctvu

[Benny]

I managed to get a pic of my discus' funny lookin Faeces...

Diagnosis would be greatly appreciated, will get a script iimmediatedly for Metro if needed

..

[Trebs]

What's the ammonia and nitrite readings from the tank?

These could certainly be causing faster respiration. Are they breathing heavier in one gill or both at the same rate? If there is an imbalance it is more likely to be gill fluke otherwise I'd look at the water conditions first.

The fact they have responded well to a w/c makes me think it's a water quality issue.

[Benny]

respiration problems are long gone, thanks to prazi :)


Just wanted an opinion on the look of the poo of my lil fishie, whether it looks like the kind u get from Hex or not

[Benny]

anyone whos dealt with hex, can they please give me some sort of a verdict :? i dont know if i should get metro or not

[Merrilyn]

Benny, it's a bit hard to tell from that pic. But it certainly does look white and jelly like, and the little fish should be a lot fatter than he appears.

I think I'd be heading for the Metro.

[ctvu]

Yes it does look like white poo to me, what symptoms do you have? Such as quit eating. Hide in the corner….


ctvu

[Benny]

Their behaviour has remained fairly normal over the past week, all eat happily and their poo's arent White, theyre a greyish colour and the other 2 are blackish lookin

[ctvu]

Are you sure they are eating normally or they eat but they spit it out straight away like mine.

I m not too sure what is wrong with this little fellow, because with Hex 2 out of 2 times my fish lose appetite and has white stringy mucus-like poo like yours but never get dark colour due to early stage.

I'd get Metro in hand ready for it, meanwhile keep an eye on this little, you may want to raise the temp by 2°C different for a day or so, if nothing improves I'd treat this little with Metro before it's too late. HTH

ctvu

[Benny]

theyre definately eating properly except my smallest, whg is getting bullied by this big nasty dude who im worrying about with the hex...
I got a much better picture but theyre all still eating normally, had a good feed of BW tonite...

Plz reply to pic,
i will get metro tomorrow... Also if i am treating for metro, should i treat the entire tank? or take the 3 discus out and put em in my new quarantine / hospital tank?

Thnx guys,
Benny

[Merrilyn]

Benny, that's definately not normal. I assume you mean they just had a big feed of frozen blood worm, and not live blackworm?

To me, this looks like the early stages of hex. Later on the droppings are all white and jelly like, as the lining of the gut is being shed.

By catching it now, it should be easily cured. They all should be treated, and probably it would be best to treat in the hospital tank, as you have to do lots of waterchanges, and dose the tank twice a day.

See if you can get the 400mg tablets. They seem a bit easier to crush, and dissolve better in the water.

[Benny]

I meant the hikari blood worms...

So you reckon bung ALL my fish in the hospital tank?

Can dwarf Gouramis, Neons, White-skirt tetras & a sailfin mollie get hex too? Also i have had my eheim in main tank for a week now, which i dont think is quite enough time to cycle? Is it better to put off treatment for a week or so? Or treat them with a pump that isnt cycled? Or i can put the fluval canister on the 2 footer, if i put all the fish in the 2 foot tank

Can the hex bug linger in the tank water too?

:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

[ctvu]

I meant the hikari blood worms...

So you reckon bung ALL my fish in the hospital tank?

Can dwarf Gouramis, Neons, White-skirt tetras & a sailfin mollie get hex too? Also i have had my eheim in main tank for a week now, which i dont think is quite enough time to cycle? Is it better to put off treatment for a week or so? Or treat them with a pump that isnt cycled? Or i can put the flucval canister on the 2 footer, if i put all the fish in the 2 foot tank

Can the hex bug linger in the tank water too?

:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

Hi Benny

I totally agree with LR, it is early stage. Pls treat them now with metro ASAP.

In regards to the other fish I have to pass on to LR or the other experts here since I don't keep them sorry. HTH

ctvu

[Merrilyn]

Benny, just treat in the main tank. It's going to be a lot simpler in the long run. I have listed below the steps you should take when treating.

Your fish is showing early stages of the disease. Treatment is quite effective at this stage.

It can be transmitted to your other fish, possibly thru contaminated droppings, although little scientific work has been done in this area. It is believed that the pathogen responsible for Hole in the Head (also known by a variety of other names such as Hex, head and lateral line erosion and wasting disease) is Spironucleus Vortens.

An infected fish may show one or several of the following symptoms:-

Skin lesions around the head area.
Turning dark.
Refusing to eat.
White jelly like droppings.
Muscle wasting and pinched appearance above the eyes.

The best drug to use is Metronidazole (Flagyl) which you will need to get from your local vet. Ring first to see if he will prescribe it after seeing a photo of the fish, or if he insists on seeing the fish himself.

1. Do a 30% water change.
2. Set the temperature to 30 degrees, no higher.
3. Add 250 mg Metro per 40 Litres of water. Crush tablets to fine powder and mix with water to form a paste before adding to the tank.
4. After 12 hours, do another 30% water change and repeat the dose. This should be done for a total of 3 days.
5. During treatment the tank lights should be left off. Metro is affected by light.
6. A variety of good quality, high protein food with added vitamins and minerals should be fed several times daily. Include prepared dry food, beef heart, brine shrimp, green vegetable matter and blood worms in the diet. Remove any uneaten food and keep the water very clean.

You should find a big improvement very soon.

HTH :)

[Benny]

1st treatment done :shock:

[Benny]

12 hours later,
poor fishies not lookin overly happy.... Hiding behind rocks,
not coming out for food etc...

Is everything OK? im a little worried,
but hoping that they will pull through :? :( :shock:

[goldenpigeon]

i hope they get better... :)

[Merrilyn]

Metro is very safe when used in accordance with the directions. Just remember those waterchanges in between medicating. Everything will be fine.

[Benny]

theyre lookin happier @ 2:46pm..

I posted that, lookin @ em at 7ish...
they obviously arent morning fish

hahaha

[goldenpigeon]

:lol: