Bare Bottom Tank Aesthetics

[Oonallee]

Hi All :D

I've just changed my community tank to barebottom, after many issues with my water parameters rising out of control and trying a few substrates with no luck. I've found that by going bare bottom I've now got no issues with water (finally)... and a happy discus (even though all his mates died as casualties :cry: )

My question is, does anyone have any ideas for aesthetics in a bare bottom tank? I've got a few live plants in there (with bases) but it's still looking a little sterile.. Any pictures as well would be great. I've scoured the net with not a lot of success and also the forum here.

P.S. I haven't tried sand as yet as a substrate, too scared after my last two experiences with different kinds of gravel..

[Oonallee]

Also forgot to mention, I am concerned that my clown loaches don't have anything to dig around in besides the driftwood.. is it worth worrying about?

[Ghoti]

I have a couple of Anubias on DW in a BB Discus tank and a heap of amazon frogbit, but overall it still looks unnatural to me and I don't like it - besides, it seems the tank is a BBA factory!!

I will be converting to a sand substrate in the next couple of weeks to address the aesthetics, provide a bit of a ph buffer (ph goes from 6.5 to 5.5 between WC's) as well as provide for some fast growing stem plants to soak up any excess nutrients.

Like you I had a lot of issues to begin with, and my learning has been costly both emotionally and financially. I think my issues were more to do with a 80% beefheart diet with insufficient water changes.


Cheers,
Scott

[Oonallee]

Hi Scott

Thanks for the reply. I am also SE Melbourne, so maybe it's something in our water! :)

I'm a little frightened of putting in another substrate but it seems it might be necessary if I want to decorate the aquarium. I think I would be happy with rocks, etc but apparently food falls between the cracks and can create issues.

I have a private supplier of all my plants and discus and am scared to go to another due to disease transfers etc. But it may be necessary to get a better range of plants/rocks, etc

Can I ask where you are getting your sand from and to your knowledge, how safe it is in regards to altering water parameters?

Thanks in advance

[Ghoti]

Another forum I subscribe to has a recipe for a DIY plant forum with Bunnings propogating sand being the major ingredient, with blood & bone, peat and marble chips included to provide nutrients, CO2 and pH buffering.

My plan is to convert my community tank over first and monitor. If all the parameters remain within the expected boundaries I will cover 70% of the discus tank with pool filter sand (from Clark Rubber) with 30% DIY substrate for a range of plants.

Cheers,
Scott

[swampy1972]

If you would still like to use a substrate you could look at Up Aqua, ADA or Eco-complete. I use Up Aqua in my planted display and shrimp tanks and have been extremely happy with the results both in terms of clarity, Ph buffering and ease of use.
It keeps my water at a constant Ph6.5 without any problems. In addition, I've found that it doesn't suffer from the initial ammonia spike often associated with some of the other brands.
Guppys online sell 9L bags for about $38ea - just bought 9 for a 5ft display I'm about to start.

[Oonallee]

Thanks swampy. Did you find you had issues with the gravel substrate affecting your water parameters? If you have resolved the problem with the UpAqua it could be a good solution for my problem.

(Yes I'm haunting the forum today, going overseas in a few weeks and want my aquarium to be happy whilst I'm away for 5 weeks :S)

[Wendy]

I am in the process of setting up a new 5 x 2 x 2 at the moment which I eventually hope to keep Discus in. I hate the look of a barebottom tank and this one sits in front of my desk so it has to look nice. But I was worried about keeping it clean enough for Discus so have come up with a sort of compromise.
The substrate is silica sand from Clark Rubber, only 1" deep and I can take some out if that turns out to be problematic. In the tank I have a few rounded river stones that can be lifted and cleaned under easily enough. Also there are two pieces of light weight wood that I have tied lots of plants to. All the plants in this tank will have to grow on the wood so they can be lifted and cleaned under. Only 4 types of plants, Bolbitus, dwarf anubias, Java Moss and Java fern(2types).

So far I am happy with the look and the plants still have a lot of filling out to do yet. No fish in there yet as the tank is still being cycled using the fishless method. (2 weeks in and ammonia is gobbled up fast, but nitrite is still taking its time. Nitrate is now raising quickly so I think I'm nearly there.)

Anyhow here's some pic's taken shortly after I did the initial plantings, hopefully once the plants fill out it will look fairly natural.

(edited to add a plant I forgot about earlier...oops)

[Oonallee]

Wow Wendy thats beautiful and will look better again when the plants develop. I'm amazed you can source it from Clark rubber I would assume substrate would have to be from a aquarium dealer only. Learn something new every day :)

I suppose I could test the water alone with the sand first and then go from there..

[Wendy]

The sand is pool filter sand and apparently its pure silica. Silica is simply glass and therefore should not alter ph in any way. I have not used it before but there are lots of threads on this forum that say its good to use but I doubt it would support healthy plants, hence I've gone for plants that don't need a substrate. I hope it works!

[Oonallee]

Hi Wendy

Well it certainly looks good :) my plants are in pots in any case so I would assume they don't really need a substrate?

[Oonallee]

I've just been told by my supplier that sand can be an issue with discus as it can get stuck in their gills (being very fine)..

[m.ingram]

[quote="Oonallee"]I've just been told by my supplier that sand can be an issue with discus as it can get stuck in their gills (being very fine)..[/

Hi just wanted to let you know that i have been running my discus tank for over 2 years with a sand bottom and i have never had this problem never even heard of it being a problem before .
Discus love a sand bottom they blow water into the sand to seperate it looking for food .Its also easyier to keep the tank clean as all the mess stays on top of the sand .

[ILLUSN]

I've just been told by my supplier that sand can be an issue with discus as it can get stuck in their gills (being very fine)..

LOL the natural enviroment of discus is fine sandy bottoms of black water habitats, what clogs gills is silt, you sand much be washed to remove all silt and dust.

[Oonallee]

What a minefield :)

Can I ask is there a particular brand/type you should use?

[ILLUSN]

I've used blue cirle and unicorn pool filter sand with great reults, you still need to wash it.

othr people have used washed sydney sand (again needs washing) and havn't had a problem

someone here used sandpit sand (again washed) and it worked a treat.

nepean river sand never washed clean for me my tank always looked hazy after a water change, so i'd avoid that brand.

[Oonallee]

Thanks Illusn, I just read a very good thread on sand here
http://fishprofiles.com/forums/Aquascaping/Sand_As_A_Substrate/37892/

In regards to rinsing it, a normal kitchen sieve probably isn't small enough to contain the fine sand particles is it? Any tips on rinsing the sand?

[Oonallee]

Found your answer to washing it, I think you must have posted it on another forum - fill the bucket with 1/3 sand and then run water through it and overflow and keep turning it?

What is the best method to put a substrate into an existing tank? Should I take 2/3rds of the water out during a change and then place the sand in the tank whilst it's partially empty - or is that asking for trouble? (wouldn't want to relocate everyone and stress them out)

[ILLUSN]

I'd drain it the 1/2 way then add sand then top up work from one side to the other so the fish stay out of the way.

[prenzi]

I have great success with sand for the kiddies sandpit from Bunnings; wash it excessively though, but it looks great - light beige and pretty natural.

[lpiasente]

I have used shallow containers filled them with gravel root tabs and plants. The tubs are surrounded by driftwood so you can't see them. I have a single layer of gravel sprinkled over the bottom. I find that sand discolours and goes shades of green. The gravel is still clean and the tanks doesn't look so bare.
Now BBA
I was having terrible trouble with this dam awful stuff. I did the peroxide dip cut back on feeding cut back on lighting then I read a post somewhere that if you add water flow near the plants then it will go. I turned one spray bar down towards the plants and up the other end of the tank I added an airstone. NO BBA. So I truly believe that this works.

[Oonallee]

What is BBA, from a quick search I did online, it looks to be some kind of algae.. Is it a known problem in bare bottom tanks or sand substrates?

[lpiasente]

It's B;ack Beard Alge. It is just known and it is dam ugly

[swampy1972]

Thanks swampy. Did you find you had issues with the gravel substrate affecting your water parameters? If you have resolved the problem with the UpAqua it could be a good solution for my problem.

(Yes I'm haunting the forum today, going overseas in a few weeks and want my aquarium to be happy whilst I'm away for 5 weeks :S)

If your substrate is changing the water parameters then it's obviously not inert. Beach sand contains calcium that will raise the hardness and Ph, so is not suitable. I've used Nepean River sand previously and it was fine - didn't alter the parameters at all but it's a pain to wash because it's supplied pretty dirty.

The only thing I'd suggest with Silica sand (or any sand for that matter) is that the waste sits on top of it and becomes unsightly, requiring constant vacuuming to maintain the beautiful appearance = extra work.

Using pots in a bare bottom works well if you have water flow at the floor to assist move the waste that will accumulate around them - have had this set up previously too and didn't like it.

I mention all this because you say you're heading O'seas for 5wks, so unless you have someone maintaining the tank while you're away you could be in for issues.

This is one of the reasons I've started using Aquatic soils. I travel extensively with work and often spend months away at a time. One of the benefits of the aquatic soils is that they assist in converting waste into nutrients for the planted scape.

Here's a pic of my planted 2ft cube after being away for 6wks. It recieved no maintenance in that time other than topping up for evaporation. Lights are on a timer and there's an auto feeder, so no-one touches the tank. It's never been "gravel vac'd" in the 14mths it's been established. I have some delicate species in there but I can't remember the last time I lost an inhabitant ;)

I've also included a link to tank that uses a combination of plant substrate, sand and gravel for amazing results. All the best with your tank, and have a great time away ;)

http://www.aquariumlife.com.au/showthread.php/17676-Jeffs-6x2.5x2.5-display-tank

http://i950.photobucket.com/albums/ad348/swampy1972/2ft%20cube%20revamp/IMG_0211.jpg

[lpiasente]

This tank is just beautiful

[Wendy]

It keeps my water at a constant Ph6.5 without any problems. In addition, I've found that it doesn't suffer from the initial ammonia spike often associated with some of the other brands.
Guppys online sell 9L bags for about $38ea - just bought 9 for a 5ft display I'm about to start.

Swampy I would be very interested in hearing how you put this new one together....do you think you could do a journal for us all to read please.

Also that cube is lovely you have done an amazing job.

[swampy1972]

It keeps my water at a constant Ph6.5 without any problems. In addition, I've found that it doesn't suffer from the initial ammonia spike often associated with some of the other brands.
Guppys online sell 9L bags for about $38ea - just bought 9 for a 5ft display I'm about to start.

Swampy I would be very interested in hearing how you put this new one together....do you think you could do a journal for us all to read please.

Also that cube is lovely you have done an amazing job.

No problem Wendy, it would be my pleasure. Just remember that I'm not claiming to be an expert, just a bloke lucky enough to bumble my way through ;)

I'll no doubt get stuck at various points throughout the build, so I'll be asking for help myself pretty soon :D

[Oonallee]

swampy that is amazing - (insert little britain character) I want that one!! :)

Thanks for sharing, I'd be happy to have your 'beginners luck'