Apistogramma Agassizi Colours

[Silkjc]

Hi all,
I have a trio of A. Agassizi which I am attempting to breed. However, the people I got them from did not know their specific colour morph (if it exists). I was wondering if any of the apisto people here have any ideas:

Male:
http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/6094/male1p.jpg (http://img340.imageshack.us/i/male1p.jpg/)
http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/6616/male2e.jpg (http://img9.imageshack.us/i/male2e.jpg/)

Dominant female:
http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/5928/femalek.jpg (http://img137.imageshack.us/i/femalek.jpg/)

Sub dominant female:
http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/3383/subfemale.jpg (http://img685.imageshack.us/i/subfemale.jpg/)

The LFS told me the male and the sub dominant female were german bred...don't know how true that is.

Many thanks!

[marty_87]

Hey,

Sorry can really help with the colour but looks like your sub dominate female has some Callumanus worms. Your probably already aware of this but if not they are easily treated with Big L wormer or anything with Levamisole Hydrochloride as the main ingredient.

HTH

[Silkjc]

Hi Marty,
Are you referring to the thin line popping out of her bum? I think she was just doing a poo at the time, it doesn't appear to be there in any of my other photos or looking at her.

[BigDaddyAdo]

I agree with Marty that it looks like worms.

The dominant female is a beaut though.

[marty_87]

Hi Marty,
Are you referring to the thin line popping out of her bum? I think she was just doing a poo at the time, it doesn't appear to be there in any of my other photos or looking at her.

Oh ok just keep an eye on it because they can go back in the body then come back out.

About the colours was looking again at your pics and they look similar to the ones I used to have.

I was told they were a.agassizi flamenco but mine look a little more yellow then yours do?
http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm51/marty_87_album/aaggi005.jpg

Wait for Briztoon to see this he should be able to help out more.

[Hassles]

One of the interesting attributes of A.agassizi is that this Apisto has numerous colour variations from somewhat drab to amazibngly colourful. There are also some aquarium strains such as the fire-reds.

Worming fish is a simple task so if ever in doubt do so - newly acquired fish should be quarantined regardless for close obervation and any treatment deemed wise / necessary. Nice fish

take care

[Merrilyn]

Gorgeous colours Silkjc.

[Robdog]

I'm a little concerned about the size of the eye on your dominant female. It seems way out of proportion to the rest of the fishs head


...and I love how much people froth over the term "German Bred" :lol: It is similar to all the "Export Grade" "Super Mega Ultra" "AAA+" bull that accompanies marine livestock.
For all we know if could've been bred by someone who knows less than we do and fluked it with a successful spawn and their dad's, fathers next door neighbour was German.

[Silkjc]

Worming fish is a simple task so if ever in doubt do so - newly acquired fish should be quarantined regardless for close obervation and any treatment deemed wise / necessary.

I've had these Agassizi for a while now and they appear to be worm free. However I recently read in Cichlid Atlas on page 229 Romer specifically advises against the use of worming pharmaceuticals with Apistogramma.


In contrast to what is suggested in the literature for various aquarium fishes, the application of deworming medication cannot be recommended for Apistogramma. They are usually very sensitive to these pharmaceuticals. Losses due to the medication normally far exceed those experienced when infested specimens are simply maintained under strict quarantine and fed well.

This seems to contradict yours and Marty's advise, at least in regards to medication. Is Romer's viewpoint on worming Apistos commonly accepted, or is this information perhaps out of date with advances in worming medication since the publication of his book?
I'd hate to get some new fish only to drug them before they even make it to the aquarium! :?

[BigDaddyAdo]

I have never lost a fish due to worming.

Beaut fish mate. ;)

[Hassles]

I have never lost a fish due to worming.

Beaut fish mate. ;)

Ado

Silkjc's comments were pertaining to the worming of Apistogramma, not fish in general. Apistos are not as easy to treat as many mainstream species (fishes) and it can be difficult to influence their recovery once they become unwell. 'Some' of the medications "out there" can be more harming to Apistos than the disease they are supposed to cure. Perhaps this is why we are all to often advised to "keep the water clean"? Prevention is easier then the cure!!!

The article in the cichlid atlas on disease is certainly one that will force a rethink about our approach to keeping Apistogramma.

While we are discussing agassizi, I have recently acquired another fire-red agassizi to start a new colony with those I have bred. This new fish (fire red agassizi) has a white seam on its caudal fin which is decidely interesting. Obviously a typical agassizi trait not quite bred out in this specimen. Yeah, remarkable variance with the agassies

[Silkjc]

This new fish (fire red agassizi) has a white seam on its caudal fin which is decidely interesting. Obviously a typical agassizi trait not quite bred out in this specimen. Yeah, remarkable variance with the agassies
Pics or it doesn't exist! :lol: Are you referring to the white stripe along the bottom which mine also has?

I found some pictures in a thread by bigbird on apistogramma.com whom appears to have similar colour patterns to my male. After contacting him by PM he believes we have Agassizi Tefe, with a bit of aquarium bred colouring.

[Silkjc]

These guys are guarding eggs, so hopefully I will have a spawn soon. They have chosen a half coconut. How will I know when to start feeding microworms and green water if I can't see the wrigglers? Will they survive without intervention until mum lets them emerge from the cave?

[Hassles]

These guys are guarding eggs, so hopefully I will have a spawn soon. They have chosen a half coconut. How will I know when to start feeding microworms and green water if I can't see the wrigglers? Will they survive without intervention until mum lets them emerge from the cave?

IF you are raising these fiah in a well established planted tank, there will be enough microraganisms to sustain them initially. If you have microworms, as soon as the fry emerge you can begin tio feed them microworms. I raiseall my Apistos on microworms.

take care

[jkomaromi]

These guys are guarding eggs, so hopefully I will have a spawn soon. They have chosen a half coconut. How will I know when to start feeding microworms and green water if I can't see the wrigglers? Will they survive without intervention until mum lets them emerge from the cave?

IF you are raising these fiah in a well established planted tank, there will be enough microraganisms to sustain them initially. If you have microworms, as soon as the fry emerge you can begin tio feed them microworms. I raiseall my Apistos on microworms.

take careCallumanus worms.
I have been treating worms of my apistos for donkeys of years with COOPERS NILVERM. Vets are using it for eradicating pig and poultry worms, however it works wonderfully well for aquarium fish as well.
The main ingredient is Levamisole Hydrochloride. I usually mix a few drops only with frozen food for the first feed of the day for a week or so (they may not like it very much if it is too concentrated, but eat it if they are hungry). It worked for me at all times. You may use 36mL/100L if the disease is wide spread in the tank. My son did it once and with success.
You may like to read:
www.thekrib.com/Diseases/nematodes.html - Cached - Similar

[Rod]

Just for the record....

Levamisole doesn't kill Callumanus worms
it paralyses them so fish can pass them naturally

Best treat fish in a bare bottom tank and vac bottom regularly or risk fish eating stunned worms and reinfecting themselves or others

I'm amazed that no one produces a fish wormer based on Levamisole...
You have to use products for pigs/birds.....some bird wormers also contain sugar and water will go milky white(bacterial bloom) after a few days....requiring 100% water change

[jkomaromi]

I must be the luckiest apisto breeder on Earth......

[jkomaromi]

I must be the luckiest apisto breeder on Earth......

However, if one GOOGLEs: "Levamisole Hydrochloride - InvestorsHub"
OR
search for en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levamisole

one may feel that I wasn't that lucky at all.

[Rod]

Not wanting to have an arguement.....

but...if you are trying to say levamisole KILLS worms

refer to data prepared for aquatic animals......
wikipedia is the last place for the truth!!!

http://www.loaches.com/Members/shari2/levamisole-hydrochloride-1

How does Levamisole HCl work?


How does Levamisole HCl work as an antiparasitic agent?

Levamisole HCl is absorbed through the gut, can also be absorbed through the skin and is distributed throughout the body. It affects the neurotransmitters within the parasite and paralyzes the worm (spastic paralysis). The fish then passes the inactive worms. Good gravel vacuuming is advised after treatment to remove the paralyzed worms. It is not ovicidal, which means it will not affect eggs already present, but it will affect the larval stage of the worm. To ensure complete eradication of the parasite treat again after remaining eggs have hatched.



There is also a lot of info on Apistogramma.com....but it's search engine doesn't work and I'm not prepared to make any more effort

Perhaps you have been Lucky!!

[Noddy65]

Rod is coreect...it does NOT kill the worms outright, it paralises them and theyre pased through with feaces.

In terrestrial animals thats the end of the story as they cant survive being on the ground without a host...Im not sure about aquatic animals BUT my feeling is that even if therye ingested again the normal acids of the stomach will make short work of them

Mike

[Rod]

Perhaps Mike.... :wink:

but worms maybe carrying eggs which aren't affected by levamisole and I assume they can handle stomach acids.....hatch and re-infect fish??

[Noddy65]

Thats true Rod but I thought they needed an intermediate host to become infective again ( a water flea I think)...that almost certainly isnt in our tanks

BUT

Im not sure so Ill try and find out :?

Mike