Bummer

[briztoon]

Well I've had a crap two weeks.

First, my new female agassizii flamenco has a massive lump behind it's head. What it is I have no idea. It would be like some one having a lump the size of lawn bowls ball on the left side of thier neck, where the neck joins to your shoulders.

My relatively new male agassizii alenquer gets slightly beat up by both his females after spawning with both in the space of three days. I move him to an empty tank, and he starts the develop little cystic nodes on his gills. His gills are fully puffed out and he is having trouble breathing.

And I come home today to find my male "gephyra" swimming upside down, or at best, standing on his head and his body is twisted into a shallow C shape, and he is breathing very hard. I fear he won't live through the night.

Poor quality photos, I'm sorry. These photo's were taken with the camera on turned 90 degrees, hence the sand appearing on the left side of the photos.
http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd105/pk3333/002-2.jpg

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd105/pk3333/001-7.jpg

I've never had so much trouble with my fish in the past and am totally bummed right now.

[Eric A]

Wow.

That really sucks peter, but you have to take the good with the bad, so hopefully a lot of good will be heading your way soon.

Eric.

[Hassles]

Bummer alright but....everything has a cause and you need to re-evaluate everything, water, water additives, environment, bio system, food, maintenance the whole kit and kaboodle as it were.

Aggression can be lessened by employing larger tanks, perhaps more complex tanks, the use of dither fish etc OR remove the male once he has served his purpose.

Live foods must be fresh and clean, frozen foods in good condition and appropriate for the species.

With regards to a previous post, if by the worst luck imaginable you're dealing with TB you could easily lose everything.

Measure everything that can be measured and keep for future reference.

I wish you luck

take care

[Rod]

Sorry to here of your dramas......I've been though many myself over the years....so feel your pain

Some ideas....I've found gill flukes can be a problem....particularly with injured or sick fish....I believe they are in most aquatic environments but don't do much damage unless the natural defences of the fish are stressed

TB could be your problem or Iridovirus
either way it wont be a positive outcome
Hope it's neither.....could just be Bad Luck!!

[steph]

I really really feel you pain pete, its often seems that everythign goes wrong at once. As Glenn says its worth going over everything youve done recently but at the end of the day its can also be a factor out side your control.

In my experience male aggies seem particularly prone to "spawning stress" I think they find it quite exhausting and I have lost almost every single male Ive had shortly after spawning Perhaps an indicator of the seasonal nature of these fish ?

In the case of the female aggie if she does die, you could perhaps consider an autopsy, or at least open up the lump and look yourself. Be very careful if you do it yourself (wear gloves etc) as fish TB will cross to humans. There was a great article that Simon wrote after he did the autopsies on his rainbows - he had TB wipe out his entire tanks - I will see if I can find it today.

All the best.

Steph

[Rod]

Article on TB

http://members.optushome.com.au/chelmon/Myco.htm

[briztoon]

Thanks for the responses guys. Yesterday I euthanized all fish from three tanks. Wasn't the best day for me.

Two tanks I have totally stripped, thrown out the substrate and hosed out, but am reluctant to clean them out with a weak bleach solution. Is it safe to use bleach to clean the tanks out, then fill and treat with Prime, then empty and clean again?

I have a fair amount of mopani rootwood planted with anubis nana and branchy driftwood covered in java moss. These do represent a significant financial outlay from me. Would it be ok to treat all driftwood and plants in a condys crystal bath, the let sit in a tub of water in the back yard for a week? And if so, do any of the local hobbiests know where to buy Potasium Permanganate? as I tried 3 chemists today, and none carry it any more.

[swampy1972]

I'm pretty sure you're safe to use a bleach solution so long as you rinse thoroughly. None of the tank surface are porous afterall.

Not too sure about the PP though. Try posing that question on the Aquarium life forum as well, as it's focus is on aquatic plant keeping. I'm sure someone there will know.

I'm sorry to hear about your loss mate.. It's a crappy decision to have to make. All the best with rebuilding your collection and don't let it put you off.

Swampy ;)

[gingerbeer01]

I got some potassium permanganate here if you want to pick it up.

Yes - it OK to use chlorine and then prime to rinse - bleach can be not as good as most have detergents in them too.

Did you separate/save any of the fry?

Steve

[steph]

Hi Pete

As much as its a horrible thing to have to do and very disheartening, especially for multiple fish, it was the right thing to do. As you know, so often with these little fish, once they show symptoms like this its almost impossible to treat.

I am still in recover mode myself from my multiple deaths. Those tanks are still holding just the sacrificial guppies and RCS - both of which are doing well so far.

All the best.

Steph

[Old Dave]

I got my PP at one of those large discount chain chemists.

The question is how can you measure such small amounts.

I just got the chemist to put 1g ( I think :oops: ) in a small clear container and use that as a rough guide to measure dose in a second container for the stock solution.

Is it possible your temp is dropping too much on these cold nights?

hth,
Old Dave

[Hassles]

do any of the local hobbiests know where to buy Potasium Permanganate? as I tried 3 chemists today, and none carry it any more.

They may not carry such but it would be very simple for then to obtain some for you. Don't accept no - harrass them to get some in - they are running a business afterall!!!

[Hassles]

I got my PP at one of those large discount chain chemists.

The question is how can you measure such small amounts.

I just got the chemist to put 1g ( I think :oops: ) in a small clear container and use that as a rough guide to measure dose in a second container for the stock solution.

Is it possible your temp is dropping too much on these cold nights?

hth,
Old Dave

When using Potassium Permanganate you pretty much want the colour of the water to change to a purple-ish colour but not a deep maroon colour. A few chrystals will do this. For inert stuff up the dosage, for plants you best stick with recommended dosages are your plants will end up in a very sad state.

[briztoon]

Again thanks for the responses guys.

I currently have all the tank equipment soaking in a tank that's dosed with chlorine, while the other two tanks are also full with a chlorine solution.

The plants and driftwood will recieve a 15 minute bath in a condies crystals solution and then be left in a couple of tubs of water in the backyard for a couple of days.