Acting Weird

[jesx57]

Hi all.

My big pearl discus woke me up yesterday morning as he was having what looked like a fit, but he was all over the tank, just going crazy. He was a stiff as a plank with his fins fully extended and just spiraling all over the tank, sometimes on his side and bumping into the condensation plates. Then he went and hid behind a log. I don't know what caused it and he just had another fit about half an hour ago. He's eating, because I was feeding him brine shrimp when the second fit happened. On closer examination, he's breaking out in fungus, so I'm going to get some meds to treat that today. Do you think that was the problem? I did notice one patch was particularly close to his eye.

What should I do? I getting quite concerned here and I don't want to lose him because he's quite a nice fish.

Please help! :(

[jesx57]

Anyone? He's not coming out now, still behind the log. What can I do? :cry:

[Hollowman]

What are your water parameters? temperature? What have you been feeding (all foods)

A few answers might help to get this narrowed down a bit :)

[lpiasente]

Would he be trying to scratch himself?

[jesx57]

Would he be trying to scratch himself?

Don't think so, when he goes into the fit he gets very stiff and zips all over the tank on his side. He did this three times yesterday.

My water parameters are:

Ammonia: 0

Nitrite: 0

Nitrate: 10

I feed freeze dried bloodworm, frozen bloodworm, frozen brine shrimp and orange discus pellets formulated for discus.

[jesx57]

I'm treating with meth blue at the moment and the fungus has already started to die off. He's becoming more active (he still hides a bit), but when he see me he comes out and feeds from my hand.

I am thinking that the fitting could have been caused by some bacteria irritation, so hopefully this product will solve the problem.

I'll keep you posted, fingers crossed! :)

[Hollowman]

What is the temp?

[jesx57]

Temp is 29.5. He took a turn for the worse overnight. Started darting around the tank again real fast. This morning the fungus seems to have made an appearance on his head. He's gone back to hiding in a log, hanging out near the bottom. When the lights are off he seems to be restless, swimming all over the tank and bumping into things.

The fungus sort of looks like columnaris, as its thread like. I am wondering whether this fungus is causing irritation to his gills and that may be why he is have outbursts of darting over the tank? Perhaps brain-damaged?

Anything else I can do? He's not looking good at the moment.

EDIT* Just read some posts on here about discus unexpectedly fitting. Could it be parasites?

[Hollowman]

I would do a salt dip or two.Follow these instructions:

Salt dip:
2 tablespoons per gallon water. ANY salt so long as ther are no anti-clog additives. Iodised salt is safe, cooking salt is cheaper.

Mix in a clean bucket with water of the same temp or from the tank. Net fish and place into bucket. After 30 mins remove back to clean water, if the fish rolls before the 30 minutes is up then remove it straight away to clean water.

Hope that helps as a first treatment

H

[jesx57]

Do I need any aeration or a heater in the bucket?

[jesx57]

UPDATE:

Now my Marlboro is doing the same thing! Twisting and darting all over the tank in a very stiff manner. What is this thing? I'm starting to think my pearl isn't brain damaged but there's some sort of disease/parasite triggering the reaction.

[Hollowman]

No, just use tank water in the bucket

[jesx57]

Thank you for your support Hollowman. :thumb

I am thinking I might do a 50% w/c, give my filter a good clean out and retreat with Meth blue again. I've been reading some old posts about high bacteria counts in water which can cause this sort of "spasmodic" behavior (the idea was actually suggested by Merrilyn).

The fungus has subsided, but that's not to say the main cause has been eliminated. The two discus are still shy, are eating (which is good). I've left the lights off to calm them down a bit.

Next option after this, (if my meth blue treatment fails), is probably leave it for a week, waterchanges, and then try a dose of prazi.

None of their other behavior is out of the norm, they aren't as aggressive as usual, breathing through both gills (from what I've seen), and that's about it.

One old post I reviewed suggested 'whirly' disease, but usually the fish die after 2 days. Well, the pearl is still holding on ('touch wood'). And, apart from his shyness, lack of aggressiveness and silly spasms, you wouldn't think there was anything wrong. :ug

Apart from that, I haven't really come up with any other theories or ideas.

[jesx57]

Hey guys,

Well, my 3rd discus to take on the spasmodic behavior has passed away. :cry: . He damaged himself so badly that it was kinder in the end just to put him to sleep. The other two are still hiding, sometimes go into silly spasms and twitch. There are no external signs of sickness, just hiding, twitching and spasms. I notice that some of my tetras are also having 'mini' episodes of darting about, and my largest one has it's gills and mouth open constantly.

I don't know what else to do, this 'thing' whatever it is, just come on so quickly. Just looking at my tank makes me feel depressed, and although I will do everything I can to prevent any more deaths, if the rest of my discus die, I don't think I'll be keeping them again. It's just heartbreaking when the ones you have grown attached to fall ill, and then die, sometimes it's just too much. I'm sure you can relate from where I'm coming from.

I've dosed my tank with meth blue again, after praziquantel did not seem to work, so I'm just hoping that this stronger dose will help. :(

[Hollowman]

Just a thought, when you put your hand in the water, do you feel it tingle at all ? I am thinking it could be stray electrical current leaking into the water from the pump or heater ?
Might be worth getting your equipent tested. :?

[jesx57]

It's funny you suggest that because I was just starting to consider that myself. I'd like to get a grounding device just to be safe, but I don't know much about them?

[DiscusDave]

You should probably look for a power board with built in residual current device (RCD). They trip if there's even a slight difference between the current coming in and going out (i.e. there's a fault to earth) and are very sensitive.

[Hollowman]

Good suggestion Dave :)

[jesx57]

I've already got a sensitive powerboard with a trip off switch, so I guess if I have that we can rule out a stray current.

And that takes me back to what the problem could be, and I have absolutely no idea.

[ILLUSN]

as hollowman said a salt bath will help, a pp did also wouldnt be a bad idea, do you have a bare tank you could use for treatment? I'd get them into a bare bottom tank and begin treating for paracites, formalin would be best but a little dangerous, start mild with a PP dip, after that dose prazi as directed for 2 weeks with a p dip inbetween, after that you should see improvement, if not you might need to concider a formalin bath

[DiscusDave]

I've already got a sensitive powerboard with a trip off switch, so I guess if I have that we can rule out a stray current.

And that takes me back to what the problem could be, and I have absolutely no idea.

They're usually not RCD's though. A basic breaker will trip when the line current goes over 10A, they wont trip when there's a bit of stray current leackage. An RCD will trip when the difference between line current and neutral return current is over a few milli-amps, they will trip is there's even a a slight amount of leakage.

[Hollowman]

An RCD will trip when the difference between line current and neutral return current is over a few milli-amps, they will trip is there's even a a slight amount of leakage.

and that is all it takes

[jesx57]

Looks like I've got some things to buy.

Thanks for all your input everyone. So far the pearl is still the same and the little checkerboard is swimming as if nothing is wrong.

No more fitting from the big pearl, but he is hiding. The marlboro red is still hiding, doesn't come out very much.