Lighting

[Rgoganj]

Hi,

I have a question for any of the planted Discus tank members.

I'm looking at purchasing compact fluro lighting, but the bulb rating is 10,000k which is a midday light, compared to 5000k morning light.

Is this to bright for Discus, or should I try to find something with a lower K rating.

Regards

Rob.G

[chrissyoscar]

I'ld be looking for a globe around 5000k-6000k. From what I hear that's perfect for planted tropical tanks.
The globes with a rating of 10000k or more are used for marine tanks because the coral requires that type of light.

Oscar

[kalebjarrod]

i find it hard to "over light" a planted tank with fluros

unless there overdriven they normally can only achive 2 wpg maximum

you will find the important factor is to give the right spectrum of light, not the wattage

you can place two identical tanks side by side, same amount of wpg but change the spectrum of light and one will grow and one will "survive"

ideal electrical is the best price but the guys in there (around me anyway) don't know and probally don't need to know what spectrum of light is produce and which lights produce it.

trial and error, sorry

[Rgoganj]

Thanks Oscar,

I've been hunting for 5000-6000k tubes, but I can't find anyone (LFS or online) that has anything less than 10000k tubes.

What is your lighting on your display tank?

Thanks Ryan

Lighting as is, equals about 1.3 watts per gallon, 55gal tank with 2 x 38w fluros, and thats not enough even with my low light plants.

[chrissyoscar]

Mine's nothing flash I've just got 2 NEC 38w 4ft standard fluro's from Bunnings. I think they're around 5000k-6000k.

Oscar

[weird]

So for 4x2x2, which when full is close to 370 litres.

http://www.adelaideaquariums.com.au/guides/lighting/fresh.html reckon you need 0.25 to 0.5 Watts of lighting are needed per litre of water.

Going for in the middle I would need, 120 watts.

I think I only have 2 x 40 watts, which means I need atleast 1 more 40 watt. This may explain my curling leaves and brown algae !?

[kalebjarrod]

you should (if you can) aim for 2 watts per gallon, plants only start REALLY moving between 2-3 watts per gallon

[jim from sydney]

you should (if you can) aim for 2 watts per gallon, plants only start REALLY moving between 2-3 watts per gallon

and for how long should the lights be left on.....too long and algea will have a pic-nic...too short and the plants will give up?????? what about CO injection in addition??
Jim

[weird]

Its nice having this in the discus section ... I think most people want to balance the bare bottom tank with serious plant growth ... best of both worlds ... plants are gorgeous.

[kalebjarrod]

lighting should be left on for 10 -12 hours per day, the algee normally has a picnic because the tank is out of balance, its normally not the added light that causes algee its the fact the plants have used any and all available CO2 and hence can't photosythisis and grow

thier are some FANTASTIC electronic CO2 injectors on the market,

they are almost idiot proof, if you have a heavyly planted tank just hook the co2 and the lighting pugs together (with a double adaptor) and turn the unit on and off with your lights. Or in our cases for a discus tank, get a digital timer and run the unit for one hour a day about two hours after the lights have come on, your plant growth will be much better, algee will disperse because your plants are growing (useing all the nutrients and CO2 in the process).


the other way is the DIY CO2, trial this on a non discus tank first, learn how to use it then take the knowlege to your tanks. for a Bare Bottom tank that you just want your drift wood to grow on or the few planted pots go for the electronic CO2


George from G&S has one in his display tank, works great

much easier than hooking up a CO2 bottle, valves, ph sensors, bubble counters etc etc the only downside is the refills are $80, the carbon pad should last for a few months at least. great introduction to CO2

fert's rarely need to be added, your pooing discus machine should give enough nitrates and ammoina for plant growth, you should add trace elements such as iron (chelated forms) maybe once a week/fortnight

this won't give you massive amounts of growth, it will combate algee and give you resonable amounts of growth.

in proper plants aquariums with 3 watts per gallon lighting and co2 at 20 - 30ppm added nitrtaes and ammoina (never great with our discus) growth can literally be watched, plants need trimming in these tanks EVERY WEEK :wink:

[Rgoganj]

Thank every one,

I have to agree with lighting as a very important part of a planted tank.

I replaced my two fluro’s three weeks ago, 1st week the plants grow almost over night and I got plants bubbling, and I noticed that the discus where a lot happier, but by the second week the plants stopped growing as fast the bubbling was stopping, but now in the 3rd week no bubbling and I noticed that the discus are not as happy as they where 2 weeks ago.

The only way I can add extra lighting is to go compact fluro’s (which seen to have 10,000k ratings), or try to fit 4 fluro’s which would cover the tank top completely, thus making feeding and maintenance very hard (removing lights every time).

MH lights are out of the question at the moment as price and the land lord would not be impressed with hanging MH fixtures from the ceiling are my limiting factors.

[kalebjarrod]

speaking of metal hal's ideal has a special at the moment for $135.00 each

bargin

you might find the lights are still working as well but the plants have run out of other essencial items

Check your CO2 and trace elements, is this a planted tank or B/B, what is your substrate?

[Rgoganj]

Ryan

My substrate is gravel with laterite (Dupla G) in the substrate.
CO2 is at 25-30 pmm, and do have ferts with all the required trace elements
(Dino pee and dino dung clay substrate balls)

For the MH lights is that $135 complete with globe and ballast ?

Why don’t the LFS have “Discus can be addictive” warning label on display tanks !

[kalebjarrod]

if they said discus can be addictive the goverment would install taxes on them like beer and smokes LOL and probably a " discus causes less weight in pocket disease" warning on the label.

the ideal price included ballast but only had a store globe not a plant globe, wrong spectrum

nice substrate, sounds like your ontop of things. maybe it was the new lights that triggered the plants into overdrive only to "come back" to reality a few days later?

got a pic for me?

[jim from sydney]

Good reading Ryan....thanks......i run my own CO2 in a non-discus set-up.....the rest is too expensive for me, still i get furry algea on the leaves it drives me around the bend sometimes. so the new discus tank will be NO live plants and bare bottom. should be ok with all the water changes.
I hope..... Jim

[weird]

I took the plunge and ordered a dalbarb double reflector for my 4x2x2 foot tank for my tank yesterday online. Arrived this morning !

Will go to bunnings today to try and pick up some fluros cheaply. In total I will have 4 fluros (as I already had a dual reflector.)

Apart from the plants which I know will have a positive effect (I want to see green algae !!! none of this brown stuff), I will be interested to see what effect the extra lighting will have on my discus and on the temp of the tank.

[ctvu]

speaking of metal hal's ideal has a special at the moment for $135.00 each

bargin

you might find the lights are still working as well but the plants have run out of other essencial items

Check your CO2 and trace elements, is this a planted tank or B/B, what is your substrate?

Hi Kaleb

You said $135 each. Is it including a single bulb and cover ? and what watt is that bulb? or do you have a web site for this? we can check it out.
Thanks a lot

Ps: your post is much helpful, really appreciated

ctvu



.

[weird]

I went to Bunnings today and bought a NEC Aquarium fluro for $24 for a 4 foot, I only bought one ... as I did not want to blind my fish and was not sure if this is such a good price .... but sometimes time is the essence. Will add another one if needed, bought the double reflector just incase (Now have 3 fluros , but have have 2 double reflectors so capacity for 4 ... this is for a 4x2x2 foot).

I usually buy my hardware stuff online from http://www.aquaticlifeaquariums.com.au/ or http://www.aquariumproducts.com.au/ , or at xtreme (great discounts from mentioning this site) or at transaquarium. At the very last resort I buy from LFS in my area.

Anyway, I am not sure Bunnings is that great. They actually stock two for aquariums, one for $18 and the one I bought for $24. Perhaps if you really knew exactly what you wanted ... which I thought I did ... but unfortunately I always err on the side of caution.

[dreamer]

i prefer those around 6000-6500K the color just right for me, under 6000K the color too yellow ... higher than 6500K just too blue :)

i believe for freshwater planted tank ~6500K is best.

[Davo]

Gday Rgoganj,

I did a lot of research into compact fluoros and ended up locating a supplier in Sydney that supplied the tubes, ballast and endcaps.

For more info look up Boronia Aquarium on a search site and go to the forums and then go to the "Aquarium Plant Forum", then to page 15 and you will see a post titled "Compact Fluoro's - Great Price." This will explain in more detail about the set up.

I bought the reflectors from the US as you cannot get quality reflectors over here. I have also just located a supplier in the US that will ship over here the highly rated GE9325K tubes for a good price. You cannot get them over here.

Dave.

[ctvu]

Gday Rgoganj,

I did a lot of research into compact fluoros and ended up locating a supplier in Sydney that supplied the tubes, ballast and endcaps.

For more info look up Boronia Aquarium on a search site and go to the forums and then go to the "Aquarium Plant Forum", then to page 15 and you will see a post titled "Compact Fluoro's - Great Price." This will explain in more detail about the set up.

I bought the reflectors from the US as you cannot get quality reflectors over here. I have also just located a supplier in the US that will ship over here the highly rated GE9325K tubes for a good price. You cannot get them over here.

Dave.

It could be great if you could post the picture of what u DIY.
Thanks

[Rgoganj]

Thanks for the info Davo,

I’ve spent some time searching for Compact fluro bits and pieces, but each time I called the suppliers they didn’t have a clue about the 55w tubes.

So if you could post the info/contact details of the supplier that you have used that would be great.

Thanks

Rob.G

[Trebs]

Weird,

The good thing about having a BB is using tall pots to 'cheat'. If all of your plants start at 6" off the bottom the watts per gallon will actually be higher as you work with an 18" depth rather than 24". Then use low light plants like java moss and java fern with driftwood to disguise the pots.

[Davo]

Rgoganj,

The company is called "Lamp Replacements", they are at 281 Parramatta Rd, Leichhardt. If you are heading west they are on the northern side of Parra Rd.

If you need anymore info, PM me.

Dave.

[Rgoganj]

Thanks dave.

Sent PM

[mtchye]

http://www.perthcichlid.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1312&highlight=compact+fluoro

I did a write up and pics on how we did it. Its quite easy and the materials can be found at lamp replacements as suggested or a variety of other wholesale lighting stores.

HTH
Vincent

[Cichlabxr]

Lamp Replacements have moved to Edwin Street, Mortlake. They are also setting up a website but not much info on there yet.

Regards

[kalebjarrod]

has anyone been able to source the ballast needed to overdrive your fluros in oz?

[Rgoganj]

Hi Ryan,

I found this place in melbourne that have electronic ballasts.
But I don't know if they sell to the public.

http://www.tridonicatco.com.au

Rob.G

[kalebjarrod]

is it the correct ballast to ovedrive your blubs?

i am yet to know of a company that understands the concept let alone the product

my world for a fish keeping electrican :wink:

[Rgoganj]

Ryan,

For example to overdrive one fluro you would get a e-ballast the can drive 2 fluros
Or to overdrive two fluros get a e-ballast that can drive 4 fluros.

If you ask any of the companies or any electrical supply shop they will tell that it can’t be done.

If you looking at extra light I found this product today

http://www.reefonline.com.au/shop/product_info.php?cPath=32&products_id=213

[Rgoganj]

Ryan,

Found this company in your neck of the woods that sell e-ballast

http://www.ndlight.com.au/ballasts.htm

[Davo]

Rgoganj,

If you decide to get compact fluoro's you do not need to get starters as they do not require them. The ones I got are $45 each and they run two 55w CF tubes. They do not put out much heat and come on instantaneously, no flickering. The 5000k tubes were $14 each, the endcaps about $1.50 each, the reflectors from the US were AU$25 each.

The branch of lamp replacements where you live should be able to get everything in. The only hassle was that I had to buy a box of 10 x tubes but you will have to replace them every 18mths to 2 years anyway so they workout very cheap compared to high end fluoros ($55 etc). If you decide to get CF and your supplier has trouble getting them PM me and I will give you the phone number of the supplier in Sydney.

There is no comparison between CF and normal fluoros. The CF are heaps better and penetrate much deeper.

Dave.

[Sime76]

Hi Davo,

I have been keeping lookout for CF's for ages with no joy. After reading this thread and the one on Boronia, though i prolly read it not long after you posted it (thats how long i been wanting CF) I took another look at Ahsupply and this time i noticed that they also do international kits :D -

A H Supply offers an international version of the following Bright Kits that will accept any input voltage between 210V AC and 250V AC at 50-60Hz:

- 2x36w Bright Kit

- 2x55w Bright Kit

- 1x96w Bright Kit

I was wondering if there was a reason why you didn't just get the whole kit from them??

Thanks

[Rgoganj]

Hi sime76,

I had the same problem with CF’s, could not find any one, and after spending about 6 weeks trying to buy the bits and pieces I gave up and purchased the aqualina CF light fixture from The Age of Aquariums.

If you live in Queensland they would be your best bet, and Ben is fantastic to deal with.

Also you could look at Aquaria Australia Warehouse, the also have the aqualina light.

I finally (this weekend) found that Ideal Lighting can supply the Osram 55W 5400k CF tubes $35 and e-ballast $80, but the only thing I couldn’t find was the clips to hold the tubes.

After a bit of research I come across T5 tubes which are a 54w for a 4ft tube.
They are a bit cheaper at $25 per tube and they also come in 6000k rating, but I’m not sure about cost for e-ballast, Ideal lighting can help.


Rob.G

[Sime76]

Hi Rob,

I've seen those aqualina CF lights on Aquaria Aust too. They don't look too bad. Not really ideal for me i have a DIY hood on my 5'. What i am REALLY tempted to do is order 4 of the 55w kits from ahsupply. It will cost approx the same as the aqualina unit although the shipping is quite costly.
I think they will be more cost effective than my standard 8 fl tubes. How hot does the unit run? same as std tubes?

Simon

[Rgoganj]

Hi sime76,

I just set up the CF lights today, heat output is the same standard tubes.
After running for a day I would say it runs hotter

But I have noticed that the brightness is less than 2 fluros, I need to check to see if this is right, I thought it would be a lot brighter being 110W compared to 72W. :cry:

I was running 3 X 36w before, but now with the CF fixture it looks very dark. :?

I agree with the shipping costs from the US are high, that was one of the reasons I didn’t buy the CF’s from ahsupply.

(If you want to see what the CF’s look like you are welcome to have a look
I live in Doncaster East)

[Sime76]

Hey Rob,

Thanks very much for the offer.
I would of thought they would be brighter too. The units look like they don't have much reflecting surface.
Which globes did you endup getting and how much and where from?

[Rgoganj]

Sime76,

I purchased the unit from The Age of Aquariums, the globes are Catalina plant growth tube, and price was $210.

You can try contacting Ben; he has a post in the “classified” section of the forum.
There were a few problems with sending the CF tubes to me they kept braking, and in the last e-mail I had from him he was think about stopping sending light fixtures interstate.

If you live near Geelong there is an aquarium that sell the aqualina fixture, at least you can get a look at what the light output looks like.

I do recommend that you have a look at the lights first, I’ve gone back to my 3 fluro setup as the fixture was not strong enough. :x :x

[revkev]

(There were a few problems with sending the CF tubes to me they kept braking.) Compact fluros globes can be sent in a PVC pipe thats how I get mine when they send them to me none broken yet. :)