Starvation.

[Merrilyn]

I've been watching my wild caught wild royal blue starve himself almost to the point of death, after recovering from a bout of hex.

Metro treatment fixed the hex, and he seemed to be recovering well.

But ............. he hasn't eaten a thing in the last three weeks. And I've tried everything ....... beefheart, live worms, dried worms, live brine shrimp, food soaked in garlic ...... and of course, a variety of dried foods with and without garlic.

He's in a 300 litre isolation tank, with dim lights, a few large amazon swords for cover, and some small tetras to keep him company. I've dropped the pH to 5, maintained the temp at 30 and added some indian almond leaves to the water for their theraputic qualities.

Suggestions anyone???? I'm about out of ideas.

[Hollowman]

Ouch!......thats a toughy!

Sounds like he still has some sort of issue, would raising the temp to 32-33 for a week help, might increase his metabolism enough to spur him to eat something.
Have you tried little red worms, from the compost heap? I think live or natural food might be the way. :?:

Hollowman

[Merrilyn]

Thanks Hollowman. I've increased the temp to 33 and dug up some wriggly red worms from the garden.

He's not interested in them yet, but fingers crossed.

Have you ever tried force feeding?

[gypsy3]

i've had the same probs with my wilds.They just don't seem to want to eat after treatment.It's a bit of a lose/lose situation - you treat them because they're not eating and have stringy faeces, but it seems that after treatment they won't eat either and end up starving. anyone else had this problem with wilds?Also, i wonder if anybody else has problems with their spotted strains - penang eruptions, anacondas etc.Mine seem very susceptible to cloudy eye probems.

[Merrilyn]

I agree gypsy. It's always a risk medicating wilds. My first line of treatment with wild fish is always increased temp and daily water changes.

Unfortunately this fish didn't respond, so meds were necessary.

I just wish he'd take that first mouthful.

It's heartbreaking.

[Hollowman]

I have never had to force feed, although I have heard that it is very stressfull for the fish, and not a real answer unfortunately. :cry:

[gypsy3]

it is heartbreaking Merrilyn.I just watched my best wild green, a truly beautiful fish, go the same way.The very best of luck with yours.

[discusluver]

sad to hear wilds are awesome fish and i wish i had a magic awnser to your probs there merrilyn :? goodluck and i hope that your fish starts to feed for you very soon would be a tragedy to lose such a wonderful fish
cheers :D

[TW]

M fingers & toes are crossed Merrilyn. He is in the best of hands. I hope he pulls through.

[Merrilyn]

Thanks for the support everyone.

Might offer him some tiny neons (sorry neons) and see if that stimulates his appetite.

He found them irristible a few weeks ago when I didn't want him to eat them. (sigh)

[TW]

you might remember quite a while back you help me with a discus who had a sore on his back. That discus didn't eat for around a month & then finally, he started to eat. He was domestic, not wild, so this might make a difference, but I hope the same happens for you,

[vyberman]

Sorry to have to say it, but you seem to me to be one of the most experienced and knowledgeable people in here.
If your asking for help then things must be desperate :(

So, in light of that desperation the best thing i can come up with is perhaps live brine shrimp?
The only reason i mention them is that unlike worms which sink, the shrimp will swim around at all levels.

Maybe if he sees food swimming past he could be tempted by it?

For what its worth, i know exactly how you must be feeling. My favorite red turk starved himself to death a while back.
That wretched hopelessness has to be the worst feeling any fish keeper can feel.

But like TW says, he is in the best of hands, so chin up ;)

[Matt15]

How did your boy go Merrilyn with the neon challenge?

[Discus 41]

Hi Merrilyn,

I know you have helped out many users from the forum in the past so I hope this suggestion may help.

Firstly I have encounted the same problem a while ago and this solution worked for me.

I had a male which wouldn't eat so after a couple of weeks I added 2 other discus into the tank (female) the reason was so the male wouldn't get beaten up.

I then added a plastic worm feeder to the tank and after an hour or so started feeding the tank,now the male didn't respond for a couple of days but for mine it was all about the discus schooling and feeding together and as the couple of females were full as a goog with food the male didn't have to compete for food or feel threated.

All the while each day i would do a 20 ltr water change with rain water and add 1 table spoon of water conditioner.

This worked for me and i hope it can work for you,good luck

Ian

[Ben]

Idea... soak live blackworms in Garlic guard. works well on stuborn marine fish, there is also a product made by seachem called entice.

HTH

[Merrilyn]

He's still hanging in there, more skeleton than fish now :cry:

Neons were ignored. Live brine shrimp ignored, garlic ignored. Even live blackworms held on forceps right under his nose, had no effect.

Spends most of his day resting on the leaves of the sword plant with an occasional swim around the tank, then back to the leaves.

I think it's just a matter of time now.

[TW]

That's heartbreaking. So sorry to hear :cry:

[Gajowa]

I am realy sorry to hear that :cry:
I might be wrong, but I was reading about similar case on another forum. In that case parasite (flagela) responsible for discus starving to death was cryptobia. Fish affected by cryptobia shows the same symptoms; stringy feaces, lack of appetite and loss of weight. It can't be seen under microscope, unles you have a scanning electron microscope. This men took the fish for a necropsy and microbiologic evaluation. Medicine that can help cure cryptobia is dimetridazol, unfortunately in Europe it is baned. Maybe you can get it in Australia?

Have you tried to feed that discus with the syringe?

[Merrilyn]

Thanks Barbara, I'll talk to my vet tonight about dimetridazol.

Haven't been game to use the syringe to feed him, but at this stage I think I'll give it a try. It can't make him any worse, and it just may help a little.

Thanks everyone, for the support and kind words.

[Tracey73]

Merrilyn did you happen to find a miracle? I am going through the same thing, my big checkerboard pigeon has not eaten for nearly four weeks now after using prazi and I am at a loss.. I have tried EVERYTHING and he will not eat. I have had him set up on his own for the last week, offered him everything imaginable and no luck :cry: I feel so bad that I can not get him to eat, its breaking my heart :(

[Merrilyn]

So sorry to hear that Tracey.

Unfortunately I didn't find a miracle cure, and like you, I tried everything to get him to eat.

I wish I knew why they do this.

It is heartbreaking :(

[Tracey73]

:( sorry to hear

Its a real bugger that we worm them so they don't get sick but in doing so chance them getting sick, its like a no win situation. The thing that really bugs me is, he was the biggest healthiest most stunning of the bunch and he did not even pass any worms unlike my other three that did, sort of feel guilty in a way but how was I to know :cry: All I can say is I have been put off Prazi after seeing this happen, I just feel really down :(

[TW]

One of my heckels is now going through this. Since starting the metro treatment, his colour is back to normal (previously he was black). But he wasn't eating before the treatment & he isn't eating now. Andrew Soh said that I should add a B Complex vitamin to the tank, as it stimulates the appetite. He also said it must not contain any sort of sugar (glucose, fructose, sucrose - whatever - none of it) as it might cause a bacterial bloom & kill the fish. I can't find B Complex without some form of sugar. I've been to the vet, chemist & Dr - none have been able to help. Blackmores have one that lists no sugar, but the chemist rang them & was told it contained minute amount of fructose. Andrew said I couldn't use it. I've sent an email off to a naturopath to see if she knows a suitable B Complex. If I find some, I'll test it out & let you guys know if it helps.

[cityguy]

I think the medication is still having a effect on your fish, exactly like we human beings sometimes feel like not eating after a medication treatment. I am sure there is still nothing much to worry as a fish can go without food for some days at-least.

I am confident that your fish will accept foods after a period of starvation and as you have up the temperature, which quickens their metabolism, it should start eating soon.

Personally I think force feeding would not be a very good idea. When the fish is not eating, it does not wants to eat.

[cityguy]

One of my heckels is now going through this. Since starting the metro treatment, his colour is back to normal (previously he was black). But he wasn't eating before the treatment & he isn't eating now. Andrew Soh said that I should add a B Complex vitamin to the tank, as it stimulates the appetite. He also said it must not contain any sort of sugar (glucose, fructose, sucrose - whatever - none of it) as it might cause a bacterial bloom & kill the fish. I can't find B Complex without some form of sugar. I've been to the vet, chemist & Dr - none have been able to help. Blackmores have one that lists no sugar, but the chemist rang them & was told it contained minute amount of fructose. Andrew said I couldn't use it. I've sent an email off to a naturopath to see if she knows a suitable B Complex. If I find some, I'll test it out & let you guys know if it helps.

There is a good B Complex for fishes called TetraVital. Its a multivitamin for fishes and can be safely used for Discus. Its manufactured and marketed by Tetra. Here is a link to the product. I have been using it since the past month for my tank
http://www.aquaristikshop.com/e_Produktinformationen/TetraAqua-TetraVital.htm

[TW]

Thanks cityguy. I haven't seen that product, but I will look to see if i can get it here in Australia. Appreciate the link.

[TW]

Hey, I got share the news. I think the previously black heckel just ate some of mals blackworms.

I think it was him - I hope it was him. He hadn't eaten for several weeks.

[Merrilyn]

Oh yes I hope it was too.

You just need him to take that first mouthful.

[cityguy]

Thanks cityguy. I haven't seen that product, but I will look to see if i can get it here in Australia. Appreciate the link.

You are welcome, I am always available with my limited knowledge in this matter, but at-least I am available :-)

Try these guys for Tetra products in Australia
http://www.aquariumproducts.com.au/

[cityguy]

Thanks cityguy. I haven't seen that product, but I will look to see if i can get it here in Australia. Appreciate the link.

You are welcome, I am always available with my limited knowledge in this matter, but at-least I am available :-)

Try these guys for Tetra products in Australia
http://www.aquariumproducts.com.au/

[Tracey73]

Well after 5 weeks of painstaking stress, tears & frustration, my big fella decided to eat!!! My 450litre tank cycled so I thought since he was not improving at all set up in a small tank on his own, I put him in the big tank so he could taste a bit of luxury in the hope it might spark him up a bit to eat something.. I also put in one of my other discus thinking it might get him to compete for food and it worked! He ate a couple pieces of flake last night and tonight he had a big helping of beef heart :) I can only hope he continues to eat and put some weight back on!

[TW]

That's excellent news. Good luck with him Tracey