bristlenose issues..... cant keep em alive

[gav]

in my large tank i just cannot keep bristlenose alive. on saturday i put 10 more in (having had no luck with previous lots). these are all quality stuff that are in prime condition. within 8 hours one was dead. the rest all sitting near the top of the tank. now this is a tank with 8 discus, 8 angels and loads of tetras. i have barely lost a fish

except bristlies

i just cant keep them alive.

so all are now gone. all look to have swallowed massive amounts of air. they dont seem to have eaten at all. they die without a mark, with defensive barbs out, just lying on the bottom of the tank. now the tank has constant airflow into it plus two eheims giving really good water movement. tank is at 30 degrees. is this just to hot for bristlenose? do i need to look at another pleco? i mean i usually cant kill them, now i cant keep them alive. any suggestions would be great

tank volume is 1450 litres, waterflow and airflow are far above requirements, temp is 30C, ph is around 5.8-6, nitrites and ammonia 0, nitrates negligible.

[discusluver]

Something is amiss, for sure. We are running almost identical setups as discus grow out tanks for babies and our albino BN's are breeding in there no worries at all. PH is at 5.5- 6 it is in every sense discus water.
From what you are telling us your water parameters are in the range for breeding based on the fact that our discus and bristlenose are both breeding in it happily.
The swollen bellies could potentially suggest worms. Did these ones and the ones you lost previously all come from the same LFS, and did you notice any white stringy faeces in the water?
Also, are you testing the water from the bag? If they are coming from water at the LFS in at PH 7, and then dropping them into a tank with a far lower PH, this may also play a part in you losing them by giving them shock.
In the end bristlies are a great companion fish to run with discus, and it doesnt sound like you are doing much wrong in regards to caring for them.
Do you have any driftwood or anything of that nature for the bristlenose themselves as it is part of a dietary necessity for them to have this in their tank?

Regards
Discusluver :D

[ILLUSN]

my guess would be ph shock followed by temp shock, try a LONG introduction period, float them for 20 mins to get the temp up slowly, then add water to the bag, about 1/4 cup every 30 min to bring the ph down slowly, if they start to show distress, air gulping darting around in the bags, stop adding water for an hour and then try again, after a few hours they should be ok to release into the tank.

[gav]

before i put any fish in the water i test both the bag pH and the tank pH. pH was virtually identical, or it was from the test kit i have. they came from a breeding tank to the display tank, so i know the fish had nothing wrong. plenty of wood in the tank. took close to 60 minutes to add them to the tank due to past issues. only possibly issue was temp, but even that was close, and in my experience fish do ok if only a degree or two diff.

the only thing that does ring true is the distress. they were gulping air right from the time they got in there.

[ILLUSN]

mate, have you got co2 in your tank, maybe turn it off for a day before introducing the bristlenoses and then turn it on at a lower bubble rate the next day after they are in the tank.

[gav]

no co2 either. i mean i have 3 airstones running to try and keep o2 as high as possible for the fish!

[Hettie_48]

I too can't keep any bristlies in my discus tank. Discus are thriving and have done so for 2 years. Temp is 30 and other water conditions are for discus. I use rain water and discus trace.
Someone suggested I might have an algae that bristlenoses don't like.
Love some help

[ozarowana]

30C is very high for BN and if they get too much high protein foods they can bloat and die too. IMO they are much happier at 24-26C. pH 5 is probably a bit low too. Even some of my discus don't like a pH that low and go dark.

[G_TAMMA]

yeah turn the temp down for sure, your cookin them :blob2

I keep mine around 26degrees. You should be ok with 28 but thats about as hot as they seem to like IMO.

Where abouts in syd you at??? If you want to try again of got plenty of these guys 4 sale and not for $9.95 like in the shops. $3 each.

Not sure about pleco's and what temps they can handle but would get very pricey..

Anyway good luck with your tank and your bristlenose.

Cheers,
Glen.

[DiscusEden]

Don't know that it's the temps though, 'cos mine have grown out & I suspect bred in the discus tank at 30c. As Illusn said, if the temps are playing a role it might be the speed of the change.

When I first got mine, I was told to put them in a seperate (small) tank at the temps & conditions they had been kept at, then slowly siphon the water from the discus tank into the small tank over a week or so, gradually increasing the tamp until it's the same water & temp in both, them put them in.


Just a thought.

[DIY]

Do you add anything to your tank other than say prime? bristles are vey sensitive to anything with copper in it for example and copper toxicity increases as the pH drops. Snail-rid would be an example, or maybe even a copper fitting on the tank somewhere?. Sorry if it's a newb type question and I don't want to offend but sometimes the most obvious things are overlooked :oops:

[Hassles]

A fish breeding friend of mine keeps Peppermint Bristlenose with her Discus at PH 6.8 and 'never' allows the temp to rise above 28 for the sake of the BN

[gav]

not temp, as it sits at 28. not copper or the like, as nothing is out of the ordinary, and i use safe on all water going in.

illusn had a suggestion when he was here that possibly it is poison wood. so, at some stage i will test that with the piece i suspect out of the tank.

[abyss]

hay there
I have 7 discus in a 4x2x2 with over 60 neon's and 20 odd glowlight's as well as 2 12' sailfin plec's i had trouble with bn in there so switched to plec's there more tolerant and leave the discus alone, the L20 and L21 are a bit cheaper. :D

[Suncoastscott]

In nearly 20 years of breeding bristlenose I have never lost a fish due to heat, although I never keep any of my bristlie tanks anywhere near that temp. My tanks sit in a non air conditioned garage and temps often reach 40+ during summer. My bristlies however are happiest when temp is in the low 20's and as a breeding trigger I often let the tanks drop to 18 degrees. I have seen common bristlies breed in everything from discus tanks with low PH to cichlid tanks with 8ph. Nothing usually phases them.

8 hours in 30 degree temp really shouldn't be an issue as they are a very hardy fish but in this instance my guess would be that this is your problem. Either that or you are being sold dud fish.

[Barracuda]

yeah turn the temp down for sure, your cookin them

I keep mine around 26degrees. You should be ok with 28 but thats about as hot as they seem to like IMO.

Where abouts in syd you at??? If you want to try again of got plenty of these guys 4 sale and not for $9.95 like in the shops. $3 each.

Not sure about pleco's and what temps they can handle but would get very pricey..

Anyway good luck with your tank and your bristlenose.

Cheers,
Glen.

Where abouts in Sydney are they sold for $3 each?

[G_TAMMA]

Shops are $9.95 each or more.

Mine are $3each.

[Scat]

Ive had peppermint bristlenose bloat up as you decribe by leaving uneaten food in bare bottom tank too long and they eat it and bloat due to a bacterial infection in the stomache, I changed my feeding habits and the problem went away.

Cheers
Craig

[shell42]

I always keep my BN's at a higher PH 7.4 and 8 in hard water they breed happily in it.

I also keep them with alot of driftwood and they seem to do fine.

I didn't think you could keep them at a lower ph, in the stores here even they mostly keep them at 7 or higher.