rams spawned

[alan j t]

hi everyone
my bolivian rams spawned in my community tank
what should i do please help

[alan j t]

its day 3 in there wriggler stage
the parents keep moving the fry in different depressions in the tank
and watching the discus battle the rams is amazing
5 inch discus vs 2 inch rams
does any one know when to feed the fry
im thinking frozen brine shrimp or maybe the liquid fry food
theres not much info on rearing rams anywhere
i keepa lamp on at night in case my zebra loach decides to have a go
at some live morsels

[Th0mas]

Hi Alan,

Congratulation on the spawn, but in a community tank will be difficult to see fry reaching juvenile age.

Feeding starts with free swimmer stage, otherwise it's a waste.

Stay away from the liquid fry food as they tend to be more of a problem than good (easily over fed and difficult to clean up). Live BBS (Baby Brine Shrimp) is the best choice. Brine Shrimp is too big for fry, they will starve.

Leaving the light on is only good for short term, as they will need their rest and eventually the loach will have it's chance.

Also when fry becomes free swimmers, the parent will not be able to protect the lot as they do wander outside of their protection. The best to remove the fry and raise separately (as taking the parent with them can trigger the parent to eat the fry) to ensure high survival rate.

Good luck.

[alan j t]

ya i thought it would be virtually immpossible to raise the fry with the loach in the community
what if i put the pair in ther own tank
would a ten gallon tank be sufficient

[Th0mas]

I think it's a bit tight - might be okay.

However even if you have them in their own, it will depend on your luck as some fish are just bad parent.

For example, my pair of German ram, they've spawned the first time and the female ate the newly hatched wiggler within hours of hatching. Then the second time, the male guard them until they become free swimmer - then the fry wander around and she ate them up slowly. The third time, I took out the female and let the male with the fry - he let them grow out a bit then ate them up. The forth try, I try the same again - and as soon as I noticed the number declined I took the male out. This time I salvaged 16 fry and now juveniles. The fifth time, they pair seems to have learnt their lesson and showing good parenting for the second day of free swimmer - then on the third day - all fry disappeared......

So the next time, I'll take control of the lot after they've reached free swimmer.

Good luck.

[alan j t]

yikes
i guess a majority of rams are bad parents
so im thinking of taking out the free swimmers with a turkey baster
what day would you recommend i siphon out the fry

[alan j t]

hi all
well all the fry are gone from the previous spawn :(
so i have a 20 gallon thats ready going for the couple
i will use the same water from the other tank
im going to try to breed them
so do i NEED to resemble the tank they were previuosly in
the tank was planted and such

any help would greatly appreciated

[Th0mas]

IMO, I wouldn't think it's necessary to resemble the look. Just make sure the water are similar and there's place for them to spawn should be fine.

Probably someone else who has experience with the Bolivian Butterfly (Ram) can offer more accurate advice.

[alan j t]

well the couple has there own tank with plants and low light
and they look comfortable but no action
anyone here know how to induce spawning
like cooler water or something else

[waitaki]

Feeding them blood worms induces spawn action. :lol:

Also maybe a small water change, they think it is the rainy season. but not too much. Someone else might want to confirm this
Good luck

[the german]

hey waitaki,good to see you here :D

bloodworms can be bad for them and cause bloat.

with the waterchange your right

[Th0mas]

Yeah - bloodworm can be bad if given too much. Only offer bloodworm as treat and never use as their main diet.

Plenty of good live food would be great, eg. BBS, mosquito larvae, etc.

[waitaki]

bloodworms can be bad for them and cause bloat.


oops, must find out where I got that info from.. mine don't get blood often, just when they behave!!

good to be here Michael :D I am a discus and dwarf cichlid forum junkie now :lol:

[fishgeek]

why are blood worms bad?

andrew

[Th0mas]

Andrew,

I don't have any proof - just by the word of mouth that they can be difficult to digest due to their exo-skeleton. Hence it's wise to avoid using it as a main diet.

[ILLUSN]

I sware that when i feed bloodworms to my fish they pass through with little digestion.

still they are a great way to get stubborn fish to eat, must be the color.

[alan j t]

speaking of bloodworms
i use frozen bw
but the lfs has live bloodworms for sale
im tempted to try them
could i use them for my rams as well as my discus

or stick to frozen cause it s safer

[Th0mas]

I would stick to frozen - to avoid the risk of parasite infection.

Unless you've been assured the live bw is cultivated and raised in sterile environment, otherwise they can be risky.

[alan j t]

thankx Th0mas
and everyone else

[fishgeek]

all aquatic inveterbrates produce exoskeletons of similar substance

i don't know that they are not bad just wont believe anything without some substantiation
blood worms were probably the first frozen food i used, and quite a lot when first breeding
2 years ago i feed almost 50% on home grown daphnia

apisto's are certainly set up to eat small aquatic invert's that whet is natural, not sure about other fish
blood worms being substrate dwellers are probably naturally found whilst sifting substrate!?

[alan j t]

hi all
im at it again with my little buggers
for some reason my little rams will only spawn in my community tank
if i put them in a tank of there own no action
so would a dither fish help or another ram help in any way as to get them to spawn
i have a perfect 29n gallon tank previously used to spawn kribs with much success
so now the rams have there new honeymoon sweet
any suggetions are very welcomed