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View Full Version : GOOD PROTEINS, BAD PROTEINS!



Paulo
Tue Nov 23, 2004, 10:46 AM
http://www.breederspremium.com/info.html

Hey,
I saw this article from the above link...Could anyone make a comment on their claim?

I'm curious specially to those people who feed their Discus with Beef Heart...


GOOD PROTEINS, BAD PROTEINS!

Recent research shows that warm blooded animal proteins such as beef heart cannot be digested easily and it remains in the fishes' stomach and intestinal tract for long periods. These undigested proteins will rot and cause the manifestation of parasites and bacteria which will infect the fishes' internal organs. Some undigested proteins will then pass out as faeces and ammonia, fouling up the water and poisoning your fish.

Marine/fish proteins are the most suitable forms of proteins for fishes because they are the type of proteins as nature intended them to be. Fishes obtain their protein diet through other marine organisms be it from a shrimp, krill, seaweed or other fishes. That is why their digestive systems evolved to cater for maximum protein absorption from such meals in their natural habitat. Choosing the wrong type of proteins for your fish may do more harm than good, for instance feeding your fish with proteins that are difficult to digest (such as beef heart) may prevent the absorption of other required vitamins or trace elements due to the fact that the undigested proteins may have formed a layer around the intestinal tract of the fish, thus making it difficult for overall digestion and absorption of proper nutrients. Wrong selection of proteins in a fish's diet may result in growth retardation and low immunity against diseases due to malnutrition. [top]

ARTIFICIAL INGREDIENTS AND COLORANT
The colors in a fish are derived from pigment cells. Pigments like xanthophylls, melanin, carotenoids and phycocyanin produce colors like yellow, black/brown, orange/red and blue respectively. Carotenoids and xanthophylls cannot be produced by the fish, therefore it must come from their diet. The common practice of fish food manufacturers is to include artificial colorant or dye in their product. In all honesty, even though these artificial elements produce truly remarkable results, they wreck havoc to the endocrine and nervous system of the fish that consumes such food.

These colorings act as replacement for pigments such as carotenoid and not the carotenoid pigment itself. That is why we sometimes see fishes that have red linings even on their fins as the coloring is absorbed into the blood system. These coloured dye pigments also hinder the absorption of nutrients in the intestinal tract. That is why we often find heavily dyed fishes are stunted, less active and very often have breeding difficulties. A fishes that passes out red faeces is another indication of the artificial coloring being not digested due to the extreme amount of dye used. Another clear sign is that you will notice that the water in your tank and the silicone glue become reddish!

Some fish food manufacturers use hormones such as testosterone to trick the fishes' system towards early maturity to speed up the natural coloration process of the fish. If fed with such hormones, the fishes will immediately "mature" to have capabilities to possess color pigments. The end result would be having fishes that stop growing, become stunted and become sterile due to the false early maturity! It has always been proven and will always remain proven that natural nutrients from natural sources will be the safest and healthiest nutrients for any animal, not only for the fish! The best natural red colorant comes from the astaxanthin which derives from shrimps, krill or marine organisms. Astaxanthin is also an anti-oxidant which is ten times stronger than beta carotene and a hundred times stronger than vitamin E. Xanthophylls and phycocyanin are the natural color pigments for the colors yellow and blue/green respectively. [top]

sunshinediscus
Tue Nov 23, 2004, 07:04 PM
exaggerated manufacturers claims is all, they want to sell you the food and want you to believe the food you are already giving them is rubbish so they say things like that. I don't believe it and i'm sure the countless other hobbiests who feed beef heart for a long time don't believe it either.

Rod

mtchye
Wed Nov 24, 2004, 12:01 AM
There is an element of truth in that research has shown that land animal protein is not always easily digested and can cause problems. However the part they left out is that this is only a problem in certain fish - and most of the research is done on common aquacultured species rather than ornamentals. Having said that I wouldn't go around feeding beefheart to primarily vegetarian fish like tropheus. Have also had bad results feeding land animal proteins to fish like goldfish. In that sense its good to use a food that does not contain land animal proteins if you want to use a single food that is suitable for a variety of fish.

Obviously beefheart is accepted fine by discus so I wouldn't worry about it. Its a good example of how research results can be easily twisted - this happens everyday, including in govt propaganda or justification for stuff the do ;)

Problem is that it takes a lot of time to prove or disprove any claims and as long as they word things carefully you can't really catch them out at it. Also most ppl don't understand the terminology of statistics.

Anyway beefheart seems to be a very economical way to get a high quality food into your discus. Thousands of breeders and hobbyists can't be wrong ;)

gsaqua
Wed Nov 24, 2004, 08:19 PM
For all of you that have a copy of Exotic Discus of the World I recommend that you read Dieter Untergrassers article on discus nutrition, Dieter Untergrassers is a VDA lecturer on fish diseases in Germany and is the author of Discus Health, once you read his article you will probably think twice before feeding large amounts of beef heart.
The article is 4 pages long and for copyright reasons I can’t rewrite any of it here, so buy or borrow the book it’s worth the cost just for Dieter Untergrassers article on discus nutrition.

George

mtchye
Thu Nov 25, 2004, 01:50 AM
Hi George,

That is interesting. Can you just tell us what he concluded or implied in his article? Were experiments done or was he just postulating theories.

I still find it hard to believe and until I can see experimental results using good protocols its going to be very hard to go against years of other people successfully feeding just beefheart mixes predominantly. One article does not a fact make, no matter who the author is ;)