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View Full Version : A crisis followed by a disaster.



Chris McMahon
Thu Nov 11, 2004, 03:59 PM
For those who remember, I haven't had the best luck with fish. There was the fry spray incident, followed by the split tank seem to name just a few.

Today I'd have to rate pretty bad too. To quote a saying: "pride comes before a fall", I had just posted about my new Red Melons and Golden Pigeon, as well as my other recent discus and how happy I was with them. I'd commented to friends that I thought I'd finally got over my bad luck with aquariums.

Now to set the scene:

At around 12pm Thursday most of the central Gold Coast had a power failure. They were saying it was a major failure effecting most of the Gold Coast and couldn't even give an estimate of when power would return until 2pm.

So having most of my tanks running off canisters, I thought that by then all my good bacteria would be dead and I'd end up poisoning my fish with Ammonia or Nitrite.

So I raced down to my LFS and bought 3 battery power air pumps ($15ea from them, $10ea from my normal supplier & a 2 hour round trip - so I get he local ones) + batteries from the "local" shop (read 3x supermarket price). So ~$60 and 10 minutes later I get home and pull all 5 canister filters and take the tops off them (I've been told this will supply enough oxygen to stop the bacteria going bad). Just as I finished this, the power comes on, around 1pm or so.

So since opening the filters normally displaces the seals (so I can't just reseal them and put them back) I spend the next 2 hours cleaning and repacking all 5 filters, putting each one into action as it becomes ready, washing them in tank water, which also requires I refill the tanks, so I end up going a 30% wc in effect also.

The fish seem to have taken every thing well and are acting normally. Normally enough that I don't both posting about it, rather put it down to bad timing and one of those things.

So apart from 3 hours lost work and $60 I didn't need to spend, no biggy.

Fast forward to 8:27pm. I'm reading forums on the computer in my home office / tank room. I'm just about to go watch "The Amazing Race" at 8:30pm. Then BANG! The 4' planted discus tank in the corner has a waterfall coming out of the middle of it. It's front panel is cracked from the very top to the very bottom right down the middle. Water is racing out of it in a stream. What would you do?

To add to the excitement, the stream of water isn't just landing on the carpet of the room, oh no I'm not that lucky, it got a perfect trajectory onto the power board for my main and breeding tanks - and everything is still running. Think about what you'd do now. Only 10 seconds or so have passed from the first crack and already 30% of 200L is "missing" from the tank.

Here's some things to consider. You've got water gushing onto a power board at an amazing rate, you've got a $2k computer on the floor next to your desk which is on the opposite side of your desk from the broken tank. You've got your best discus in the broken tank (say >$1500 replacement cost) as well as $150 of Rainbows and $60 breeding pair of Bristlenose, and the tank is fairly heavily planted with vine-like wood giving 100% change of the fish avoiding a net.

Having fun yet?

Here's what I did:
The water had finally tripped the safety switch on the power-board. My main 5x2x2 tank and my 120l breeding tank now had no lights, air or filters. I turned off the other switches for my other tanks in the room and computer and grabbed as may towels as I could from the linen room. Putting the towels against the 18" crack (press against the crack with my body) slowed the gush to about the same as a garden hose on full. Grabbing the only bucket in reach, I grabbed the closest net (too small but the large one wasn't insight at the time) and scooped out 6 adult discus into the bucket.

I then left the leak to it's own devices (it had slowed somewhat as 50% of 200L was now about my ankles) and transfered half of the bucket to one breeding tank, half to the other. I now had 5 discus in each 120L tank.

I then returned to the broken tank and got the remaining 2 adult discus and put one each into each breeder. I now had 6 adult discus in each 120L breeding tank. By all accounts, overstocking 200%.

By this time, the broken tank had maybe 25% left in it. Therefore 150L was on my floor.

I grabbed another bucket and pulled all the plants and removed the driftwood so that I had a hope of catching the Rainbows and bristlenoses. I'd say the plants were worth around $150-$200 to replace (since I didn't have room in my other tanks, they got binned). I'd had Anubius growing on the wood. I'd had stem plants coloured up to great red/orange shades and recently added 8 pots of hair grass.

If you've seem my 5x2x2 planted pics, I'd say the 4' was a better looking planted tank. It was that good, being planed from the beginning, and with the experience of my other tanks.

By now I'd emptied the closet and I was knee deep in waterlogged towels, maybe 30 towels. The tank had maybe 10% left, ~180 litres on the floor. I scooped up the 20 odd rainbows and bristlenose pair and put them into the bucket the discus were in a few minutes before.

Now I had a minute to think. As I saw it, my main problem was no power. I unplugged everything from the main tanks power board and lifted it up. Water streamed out of the power board. Not good. The light timer was making sloshing noises and the double adaptors were dripping wet.

It was probably 30 minutes since the power went out and I was getting concerned about the canister filters again. I needed to get the power back on. Using every towel in the house, clean or dirty, I managed to get the area under the main tank (which housed the main tank's two canister filters, a 120L breeding tank, the breeding tank's canister filter, two air pumps, and the power boards for all the above) relatively dry. It also seemed that the main house breaker had tripped along the way too as all power in the house (except lights) was off.

Checking now on the Rainbows I noticed that 6 had jumped from the bucket onto the floor. 4 were too far gone, 2 were still twitching. I returned the 2 to the bucket, with a glass cover and hoped for the best.

Half an hour later (60+minutes after no power) I got a power board from another room and got the the main and breeding tank back up and running. The floor was still awash with water, but the shelf the power board was on, was off the floor.

I put the remaining Rainbows (the 2 made it) and bns into my main tank.

I then spent the rest of the evening using towels and blankets to try and mop up what water remains. The carpet (yeah I know - carpet & tanks don't mix) as I write this is still very damp. I expect the usual fowl smell to take over the room for weeks as it drys.

I've just finished scooping out the sand and substrate out and binning it (say $50 replacement). I dragged the stand and tank out to the yard and got the tank off the stand. The stand was very damp and I'm sure it would have warped if I left it over night.

The computer got a shallow bath. It blew it's USB and firewire ports (mounted at bottom of tower case) and is giving a constant verbal warning (very annoyingly) "CPU failed system test" which seems erroneous as I'm typing this now.

So that's my tale of woe.

My main concerns now are;
1) What, if any, damage did the earlier power failure do to my filters?
2) What, if any, damage did the 2nd power failure caused by the wet power board do to my filters?
3) Will the 2 breeding tanks handle the sudden increase in bioload?
4) How I'm going to replace the broken tank, if at all?
5) Why I've offended the fish gods that they feel it necessary to kick the s h i t out of me on a regular basis?

BTW for those of you who believe bad luck comes in 3s - Wednesday a Cory in my main tank decides to make a splash on the surface that has the perfect trajectory to hit the MH light cover (10" above and on an angle) - shattering it in an instant.

Oh and the broken 4' tank is the same tank that split it's seem on me the other month - yes, I had the seem redone and all four corners reinforced with external braces, by a professional tank maker. Looking at the tank I can see that the centre brace isn't connected to the rear wall and the tank split right at the point when the brace joins the front pane. I'll be having a few choice words with the guy who did the job on the tank. He better have good answers.
:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

Lee C
Thu Nov 11, 2004, 07:00 PM
:x

africandiscus
Thu Nov 11, 2004, 09:13 PM
OMG :shock:

Aurora
Thu Nov 11, 2004, 11:32 PM
........gee talk about bad luck.

I remember those Red Melons too, they were really good. Their still OK arent they?

At least one positive is that you were there at the time to save the fish........if it had happened during the day when you werent there it would have been a lot worse :(

africandiscus
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 12:09 AM
Should be expecting a rise in insurance premiums :wink:

weird
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 12:15 AM
Dude , I am going to find some wood to knock on.

Wow-shers !!!!

parasite
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 01:25 AM
geez.....thats bad. hope your fish are ok after all that .

skoom
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 01:57 AM
sorry to hear...

Billy
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 02:05 AM
good luck to all your fish, hope they are ok

Dave76
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 02:29 AM
Sorry to hear about your troubles Chris :(

1. I've had the power go out for up to 3 hours before on cannister filters with no ill effects, so I wouldn't be too worried about that IMO.

2 & 3. Can you increase the filtration on the tanks the fish are currently in, perhaps using the filters from the broken tank? It might pay to see if you can get some of that tank starter bacteria stuff if the ammonia etc becomes a problem - I've never used it before, but it may help re establish filters.

4. You could look at replacing the whole panel, but if it was me, I'd replace the whole tank & use the rest of that tank for lids.

5. Can't help you with that one - perhaps go and buy a lotto ticket - you've had the bad, it's about time for the good.

Another thought - is there anyone you know with a spare tank, or extra room that can temp house your extra fish, perhaps even ring your LFS ?

Hope everything works out ok for you.

Dave

Trebs
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 02:38 AM
From what I have heard, once the power goes out bacteria in a canister filter will start dying off at the 4hr mark. Don't no how accurate this is.

It may be a good idea if you live in an area prone to lengthy power outages to use a HOTB filter in conjunction with canisters. A HOTB will keep bacteria alive for longer as it's water surface is exposed.

Chris McMahon
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 03:11 AM
Thanks everyone for your kind posts.

To answer specific questions:
I remember those Red Melons too, they were really good. Their still OK arent they?Yes the were in the that tank. One of the Melons looked dead in the bucket as it was laying flat on the bottom with the others swimming above it.
So far, my only losses were the 4 jumping Rainbows, and the batch of eggs just laid in one of the breeding tanks. There was also the usual fighting when the original pairs had the sudden influx of visitors.

I'm testing Ammonia and Nitrite on all my tanks twice daily. Hopefully I can keep it under control with water changes.

At least one positive is that you were there at the time to save the fish........if it had happened during the day when you werent there it would have been a lot worse :(Yes, if it had happened when I was out that morning and I lost the whole tank, and possibly the other tanks, I would have called it a day and got a pet rock.

Should be expecting a rise in insurance premiums :wink:My premium stayed the same, $0. Of course the payout also matches the premium.

It might pay to see if you can get some of that tank starter bacteria stuff if the ammonia etc becomes a problem - I've never used it before, but it may help re establish filters.I've used several brands of that stuff before. All useless. I mean how can a product made of oxygen feeding bacteria survive in a sealed container for 2 years? The stuff would be dead within a week of leaving the factory.

4. You could look at replacing the whole panel, but if it was me, I'd replace the whole tank & use the rest of that tank for lids.That tank is history. It's been nothing but trouble since I got it. I'm thinking about replacing it with 2x 24x15x18s instead of 1 48x15x18.

Another thought - is there anyone you know with a spare tank, or extra room that can temp house your extra fish, perhaps even ring your LFS ?Unfortunately not. At least no one who can take discus, or that I trust with my best fish. Of course should I start seeing ammonia or nitrite spikes, I'll have to sort something out.
It may be a good idea if you live in an area prone to lengthy power outages to use a HOTB filter in conjunction with canisters. A HOTB will keep bacteria alive for longer as it's water surface is exposed.I've got a HOB on one of my breeding tanks. Unfortunately all the other tanks have 50mm bracing around all four sides so HOB filters won't fit on them.

Aurora
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 05:00 AM
"I mean how can a product made of oxygen feeding bacteria survive in a sealed container for 2 years? The stuff would be dead within a week of leaving the factory."
- Chris McMahon

Two words: spore former. both Nitromonas and Nitrobacter are spore forming bacteria. This means that if the conditions become to harsh for survival they produce a spore containing all their DNA. They then die (so your right they are all dead in the bottle). Spores are very resistant to many harsh conditions and are able to survive years. Once they are back in a suitable condition (eg. the tank) the spores will then germinate to produce new bacteria.

So in theory bacteria in a bottle should work. Wether it works in practice, I dont know.

Al
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 05:53 AM
Mate i'm really sorry to hear about that... I think you did a lot better than i would have, I probably would have just curled up in the closet head between my knees rocking back and forth. This is not happening, this is not happening...!

Best of luck with the aftermath, I hope you don’t loose any more of you friends.

I'm with Dave76, go and get some lotto tickets, your due!

Chris McMahon
Fri Nov 12, 2004, 09:50 AM
Two words: spore former. both Nitromonas and Nitrobacter are spore forming bacteria. This means that if the conditions become to harsh for survival they produce a spore containing all their DNA. They then die (so your right they are all dead in the bottle). Spores are very resistant to many harsh conditions and are able to survive years. Once they are back in a suitable condition (eg. the tank) the spores will then germinate to produce new bacteria.Interesting. Well it seems to me that whatever they are meant to do, they don't. I spent 2 months buying bottle after bottle of these products trying to cycle my first tank. Never made any difference, except to my wallet.

I have heard good things about a US only product that contains live bacteria. Apparently they sell it with a 2 week shelf life and require it to be refrigerated in the LFS, which seems to make more sense to me.

Dave76
Wed Nov 17, 2004, 07:58 AM
Hi Chris

How goes the ongoing tank saga ?

Dave

kalebjarrod
Wed Nov 17, 2004, 09:51 AM
ohhhh myyyyyyyy goooooddddddddnnnnnnneeeeeeessssssssssssssssssssss sss

i have a spare 44 gallon drum sitting in the gararge for the exact reason of a tank crack

and you know while i have it i will never have a cracked tank (murphys law)

if you want chris i will give you one for next time, or water changes!

Chris McMahon
Wed Nov 17, 2004, 10:58 AM
It'll be a week tomorrow since the break.

Thankfully I didn't lose any discus, or any other fish since the 4 Rainbows I lost the night of the break.

As you'd expect the Golden Pigeon and Red Melon pair's eggs were gone within an hour of me putting the extra discus into their breeding tanks. During the first 2-3 days there was a lot of fighting in the two breeding tanks, as you'd expect, when numbers went from 2 per tank to 6 & 7 per tank.

I think my over-filtration on the two breeding tanks helped them cope with the increased bioload very well. I never got high levels of ammonia or nitrite in either tank. The doubling of water changes helped too I'd say.

As for the room, the carpet is cactus. But it was water damaged previously from a leaking sink in the adjoining laundry anyway, so that's no big deal. I had a large fan on all the time for 5 days to keep air movement up - which let the carpet dry. The smell wasn't as bad as I expected.

The broken tank is sitting in my yard. I'll never use that tank again. That's the second time it's failed and I won't give it a third chance. I lost about $200 worth of plants, along with the rainbows. I had no tank space for them and had to bin them.

Some good has come from this though. It's given me the excuse to replace the 48x15x18 tank and pine stand. I've ordered a new black powder coated, two tier steel frame. I've also ordered 2x 24x15x24 tanks for the top and 2x 24x15x18 tanks for the bottom. They should be ready in a week or so. Needless to say, the old credit card took a fair hit for those.

Hopefully with the 4 new tanks, I can get some wrigglers out of my pairs, once the settle in. These discus are sending me broke. :lol: I think I need Discus Anonymous.

Dave76
Thu Nov 18, 2004, 04:49 AM
Good to hear you didn't lose any Discus :)

And any excuse for new tanks is a good one...

Dave

kalebjarrod
Thu Nov 18, 2004, 09:55 AM
ahhhhhhh chris

i like your menatllity

one blows up so i'll buy four more

nice work, next time (i hope never) you get a blow out call me

we are neigbours and i am sure i could have stolen i mean saved your plants lol

Chris McMahon
Thu Nov 18, 2004, 12:41 PM
Thanks for the offer kalebjarrod. At the time I was a little freaked and if you asked me I probably wouldn't have know my own name.

Thanks for the offer of the drum too. Unfortunately space is my major issue atm. If I get a bigger place in future I'll definitely make sure to save some space for a water ageing drum.

Vinh
Thu Nov 18, 2004, 04:30 PM
Ouch man!

I cant image what I would do if it happen to me, my mouth would proberly just swing open. Go grab the keys and speed down the highway till I go back time.

Seriously, I would be lost in the head if a tank broke on me. I just cant image 200L of water let alone my new tank of 700L.

You handled the situation very well. Insurance cover these type of things? I thought it only covered accident item damage and robbery.

What was the extent damage yo the carpet and floorboards?

Good luck with the new tanks comnig, need some pics when they are setup!

xen
Sat Nov 20, 2004, 04:41 AM
Heya Chris,

Good gravy mate - I just cannot believe the horrible run of luck you've had so far with your fishkeeping!

For 'next time' (which we both know there won't be), your plants should be okay in a bucket, at least for a few days. Just so long as they stay wet, they're pretty resilient. I've had a bunch of plants I left floating in a tank, no light, heat or filtration for about a month. Most of them survived, and with a bit of trimming and replanting, came back good as gold.

I would be asking some very serious questions of your tank-maker (possibly with some heavy, blunt objects).

I reckon you handled the situation very well though. Sounds like you have a cool head in a crisis :-)

Well, good luck with the new stand and tanks! Let's hope the gods of the fish have finally forgiven whatever transgression it was that set them off on you.

All the best,
John

Chris McMahon
Sat Nov 20, 2004, 05:25 AM
Insurance cover these type of things? I thought it only covered accident item damage and robbery.I've only got house, not contents, so not covered.

What was the extent damage yo the carpet and floorboards?It's carpet on underlay on concrete. The carpet was cactus anyway. Before I got my first tank, my washing machine tap had a teak - for about 6 months. The laundry is next the the home office/tank room so water leaked through/under the wall and the carpet rotted under several filing cabinets and desk.

I've now got an extra water stain about 12"x3" due to last week. Guess I'll have to cancel the Better Homes and Gardens photo-shoot now. :lol:

Good luck with the new tanks coming, need some pics when they are setup!Will do.

Good gravy mate - I just cannot believe the horrible run of luck you've had so far with your fish keeping!Yeah, it seems to be one kick to the crotch after another lately.

plants should be okay in a bucket, at least for a few days. Just so long as they stay wet, they're pretty resilient. I've had a bunch of plants I left floating in a tank, no light, heat or filtration for about a month. Most of them survived, and with a bit of trimming and replanting, came back good as gold.Well it's been a week now. Probably another week before the new stuff arrives. A lot of plants were high light loving plants that wouldn't have taken too will to two weeks in a bucket. It'd just put in 8 pots of hairgrass (about 4 hours work) a week or so before the break. You can't really pull that up and hope to replant it.

Also I'd spent a few months training Anubius to grow on the vine-like wood. Pulling the wood out ripped them apart pretty badly too.

In hindsight I may have been able to save more of the plants, but at the time the $1500 worth of discus were my first priority.

I would be asking some very serious questions of your tank-maker (possibly with some heavy, blunt objects).I bought the tank, stand and hood 2nd hand off the QLD forum. The guy who sold it too me was a real piece of work and I got took, pure and simple.

Let's hope the gods of the fish have finally forgiven whatever transgression it was that set them off on you.You and me both. I'll sacrifice the next door-knocking Mormon to my fish gods just to make sure.

xen
Sat Nov 20, 2004, 05:43 AM
You and me both. I'll sacrifice the next door-knocking Mormon to my fish gods just to make sure.

Hahahhahahahha. Sounds like a plan. Just don't get any blood in your tanks. In case you haven't heard, once discus get a taste for human blood...

Cheers!
John