German Blue rams vs Blue rams

[zar]

Hi

Can someone tell me what the difference is between a german blue ram and a normal blue ram? At the moment, i've got the impression that the german rams are more colourful than the normal ones, but how do you exactly differentiate a german from a normal one?

thanks

[Th0mas]

The German ones are reputable for better quality, however some Asian breeders are catching up with the quality section so it is really not much different.

Just go for what you think you're comfortable with.

[gingerbeer01]

Everything quality has the german name attached to it - german Rams - german bred apistos - BMW's

8-)

Many German fish actually come from asia apparantly :shock:

Just look for the best quality you can find - I like a bit of red in the nose - blue around face and through body and fins - I look for a second dorsal spot - as seems to be closer to wild fish - well that is my theory - I don;t look for size - Also if Male and Female are not obvious I walk away - and I walk away from the occasional German extra large - as Extra Large means old I reckon........

HTH

Steve

[Ben]

other than the look there is a slightly larger price tag on them.

[*Chris*]

there is also the fish TB that effects most fo the local or asian bred rams
the darkening the bloating and the general dropsy look is usually TB
TB is caused by bad genetics and in breeding
german bred rams usually dont have this problem at all nor do there dutch cousins

[fishgeek]

chris why do you believe that certain strains of rams are free of tb?

[Th0mas]

Andrew,

Am also curious on Chris' theory.

Perhaps the German one are less likely to be carrying TB due to their quality control. Or maybe their strain is more resistance to TB infection. But never immune to it though.

[seecuta]

TB is caused by bad genetics and in breeding

im more concerned about this statement

tb is quite epidemic and can persist in the latent phase without ever showing symptoms, which theoretically should apply to the german lines aswell.

[zar]

Hmm, interesting points

so in the end, its mostly the looks as i thought. Yeah, i had so many rams die i dont even know why i'm bothering anymore, especially balloon rams which i find a bit more interesting than normal rams.
most of my rams, or 90% died the same way, suddenly, heavy breathing one eye swells up and they're gone the next day..it was probably some bacterial infection. i recently bought some nice ones from one of our sponsors, with really strong colouring, the black bars that go over the eyes go all the way up and nearly join on the forehead which looks very nice, they were from cairns and they look more colourful than my other rams, so maybe they're german, actually she's german, because the male died just after a few days :-s
everyone's talking about discus being soft fish, but i reckon rams are not much behind..at least these inbread ones we get from stores...

[gingerbeer01]

In bad water a Ram will go before a discus. Rams are very sensitive to bad water.

I am not a fan of balloons and depending on who you talk too - some say they are tougher some say weaker. I think that it depends on the quality of the Ram. A good quality Ram is easier to keep than a good quality Baloon - but more rubbish blue rams than rubbish balloons around.....

In what I have seen in Brisvegas I have difficulty recomending anywhere for Rams up here - and would say be careful as I do believe one of the local breds is carrying something - not sure what it is but..

[zar]

Hmm,

i first came accross the balloon rams, up to now they're still probably my favourite fish apart from discus. All of my initial balloons died, one pair bred in my community tank, didnt get any fry though. i think the beef heart mix didnt do em good that i fed my discus :-s
i bought some local blue rams, two females and a male, the male paired up with one and the other one got chased so hard until i found her dead one day in the tank. they bred a few times, i had a bad hatch rate though, not sure what it was, only 3 hatched the first time around and two are alive and currently nearly mature in my tank. i'm not keeping them together with my discus as i think that they dont take the beef heart mix too well.
i've been looking for good balloons in bris vegas, but yeah havent come accross good ones for a long time now, they're either not balloony enough, they nearly look like normal rams, or they have bad colour or fungus or other similar things..
now that my rams are in another tank they seem to be fine. i hope they'll breed again.
i've bought some apistogramma cacatuoides this weekend, not the firey orange tail ones, my male has more of a yellow tale, i'll see how tough they are, its' the first time i'm giving apistos a go. i'm also hesitant to put them into my discus tank as i'm not sure how they'll handle beef heart mix...

[fishgeek]

zar the apisto's will live longer if kept at around 25 celsius so although higher tems do occur for them naturally they should not live in those temperatures constantly

what are the fish shops in brisbane like?
i left 13 years ago.. used to buy birds(finch's) as a kid from a nice place that had a very large (to me as a kid) fish section in taringa circle... where moggil road split into two one way sections

your are probably on other side of brisbane.. being such a spread out population probably makes retail fish shops less use? though couriering live fish over a continent that size wouldnt be much fun either

andrew

[gingerbeer01]

Zar,

I have been proven wrong Wetpetz have some spectacular blue rams in at the moment. Have a look at them and then tell me you prefer Balloon Rams. :lol: :twisted:

Local bred too so should breed well. Was tempted but alreaddy have 2 pair - so got another famle Bitaeniate instead.

[zar]

fishgeek

i think there is a pretty good variety in brisbane when it comes to aquarium shops, especially if you keep african cichlids, there is tons of people breeding them privately you dont even need to go to the shops to buy them.
when it comes to discus, apistos, and other latinos :), not more than 4 shops come to mind that i find to be good...however, i'm on the southside so not sure what's avalable on the northside,
i was in taht taringa lfs a few months ago, had some nice fighters thats what i remember from it.

gingerbeer01

yeah i saw them, good size, but i still prefer balloons :) they had a few small balloons there as well but didnt look taht great..
the balloon ram has got the same size finnage, same amount of color on a smaller body which makes it just look better i reckon.
bat as i said before, i havent seen good balloons in ages.
the best blue rams i ever saw were in pet city, maybe 2 months ago, sold as german blue rams, $12 each, which now taht i think of it was pretty cheap, the colors were very intense and they were quite small still.looked awesome..

[gingerbeer01]

$12 each for german is a steal......

I would expect to pay around $25-30 for good germans.

[Robdog]

i havent seen good balloons in ages.
In my opinion, I've never seen a good balloon anything. Rams, BN's, mollies, they're all the same. Physically mutated and retarded fish that should be boycotted from stores.
[/End Rant] :evil:

[zar]

didn't know balloon BN's exist...
yeah, thats one of the reasons why i dont keep em anymore.
speaking of retardations, are longfin variations of fish also actually retardations or do they exist like that in nature, does anyone know?

[Robdog]

The chance of it occuring naturally can happen but it would be rare I would think.

[Th0mas]

IMO, all physical mutation will occur in the wild. But the likelihood of these fish reaches adulthood is rather low as the mutation exposes them to greater risk of being pray.

[Robdog]

That's what I meant to say but Th0mas said it better. ;)