Tapeworm treatment for Discus but safe for Bristlenose/Tetra

[enigmatic]

Hi,

One of my Discus passed a long white stringy poo this morning. The poo went on to wriggle and squirm around and I've since seen 2 or 3 in the tank today.

Based on what I have read and looking at photos, I believe this to be tapeworm rather than threadworm.

What treatments are available that can be used to treat Discus but are not harmful to Bristlenose or Tetra?

I have some Aquarium Science Aqua Worm that I bought a month or two back as a contingency for flukes and tapeworm. This contains 100mg Prazi but says it should not be used with Tetra.

Please can anyone here help?

Thanks,

Chris

[fiftycal]

Have you considered getting a medication tank?

[enigmatic]

Have you considered getting a medication tank?

Yes, a work in progress already but around 6 weeks from being ready (hasn't been delivered yet).

[enigmatic]

Anyone able to help?

Having seen these worms, it would go some way to explaining why some of my Discus have grown and others have stayed the same despite eating heaps.

I've finished treating my tank for the whitespots that were the subject of another posting here and the tank should now be clear of any traces of the previous meds.

Thanks in advance.

Chris

[fishgeek]

praziquantel is suggested as being safe and i do not know if there are any exceptions

treat a bucket of water as a hospital tank if you are worried about treating the main tank

i keep small fish and often have jugs floating in the main taink for smaler volume treatment receptacles

andrew

[scott bowler]

chris have you not got octozin , that will do the trick and we can get it now ,

[fishhead]

Tapeworms are becoming more and more resilient to prazi , desolving in tank water usually achieves little resultes except killing some other occupants.I found by crushing a prazi tablet to powder and then mixing it with food and feeding it directly to the discus by hand if possible. This elimates most problems with other occupants. prazi is quite safe and even an overdose rarely produces sidefects in discus. vet grade prazi seems more effective than aquarium grade. Make enough to feed then once a day for three days. Store it in the fridge.

[enigmatic]

I guess I could treat them in a bucket but my concern now is that some of the worms are out the fish and lose in the tank.

If I treat the fish outside the tank and don't treat the tank, won't that mean the worms will still be there and will only reinfect the fish?

Yes, I have Octozin. Have some on order with ASA but also saw the LFS had some so picked some up there on the weekend as it was mentioned in my other thread.

Whilst I could use Octozin now, will this actually get rid of the worms or just make the Discus pass them?

[scott bowler]

it will kill the worm and any they may have it wont hurt the tank it will get rid of them all dont wait just treat if you have them ,

[enigmatic]

Tapeworms are becoming more and more resilient to prazi , desolving in tank water usually achieves little resultes except killing some other occupants.I found by crushing a prazi tablet to powder and then mixing it with food and feeding it directly to the discus by hand if possible. This elimates most problems with other occupants. prazi is quite safe and even an overdose rarely produces sidefects in discus. vet grade prazi seems more effective than aquarium grade. Make enough to feed then once a day for three days. Store it in the fridge.

I had thought about mixing some with food but couldn't work out:

1) Quantity - what to mix with and how much food to prazi
2) If I treat by food, will this kill any worms that have got out into the tank.
3) Do these worms have eggs that also need to be killed?

[enigmatic]

it will kill the worm and any they may have it wont hurt the tank it will get rid of them all dont wait just treat if you have them ,

Hi Scott,

Please can I clarify if you mean treat Octozin or treat Prazi?

Thanks,

Chris

[scott bowler]

oh sorry mate no use octozin imo that is all i use scott

[enigmatic]

Thanks everyone for your input.

Guess I will start a course of Octozin tomorrow then unless anyone thinks otherwise?

[enigmatic]

Hi,

Ladyred replied to a PM I had sent her and on her advice I dosed the tank with Prazi.

All is well at the moment. Prazi went in the tank Sunday night and all seem to be present and correct. Did a water change last night and will dose the tank again this Sunday to try and stop a repeat infection.

Like I say, all fish are present and correct. They do seem a bit fussy with food at present but some have passed long white solid poo that are not wriggling so I'm hoping that once they get the worm out the system, appetites will return.

Cheers,

Chris

[Merrilyn]

Glad to hear the Prazi is working Chris :P

[enigmatic]

To Ladyred and everyone else on the forum, thanks for all your help. I'd be lost without this forum and all the help.

Came home this morning and the Discus have perked up more and actually come to the front of the tank as I approach but are still fussy about food.

My checkerboard had a 1cm white worm like poo hanging out but this has now fallen away. My blue diamonds are hanging back and looking a bit dark though.

Will keep an eye on the tank and may try and fit in another water change before Sunday before dosing the tank with a further dose of prazi.

If the prazi kills the worms, would I still need to dose Octozin to clear out the internals or is it more practical to dose say epsom salts to make them poop out the (hopefully) dead worm?

Thanks again,

Chris

[enigmatic]

Hi,

Can anyone offer any more advice on this? The Discus that is my avatar is passing quite large, mouse dropping style dark poo. This Discus has grown quite a bit since I got it so I guess didn't have worms.

Other Discus in the tank continue to pass white poo and most are still very fussy about food. Very few of the Discus are showing interest in a variety of food that I have tried and a lot of just lurking at the back of the tank behind driftwood/plants.

I'm just a bit concerned that the Discus aren't eating much and still wondering about the Epsom salts/Octozin situation.

Thanks,
Chris

[fishgeek]

i cant say i know just my opinion below

i dont put much creedence indead worms causing death of fish, the medications traditionally used to kill helminths (worms of all families) are usually paralysing agents
hence the worm is no longer able to suck/bite/grip onto the intestinal tract and should be passed naturally

in mammals i would in large worm burdens that are treated , expect the dying worms to temporarily cause a diarrohea by virtue of irritation


equally white floating or stringy stool i think just means that mucous has been liberated into the digestive tract because of irritation to the intestinal mucosa(lining) this can be due to many things and is not diagnstic of either worms or protozoa , they maybe the statiscally most likely though

personally good food that the fish are interested inshould get something going through there guts and force things out
i cant see that amgnesium salt in epsom would be harmful if used as a purgative

just my 2 pence
andrew

[Merrilyn]

Andrew, your opinion is worth way more than two pence to us. It's invaluable. Thanks for your contribution :P

Chris, as Andrew says, an epsom salts treatment may be worthwhile at the moment, but be sure to clear out all the previous medication before you start.

After the treatment, try feeding them some live brine shrimp. Very few discus can resist them, and it just might kick-start their appetite.

[enigmatic]

Andrew,

Thanks for your input, much appreciated.

Ladyred, I got some live brine shrimp and there was a great deal more interest in food. I've also found that by trimming back the lotus that had grown quite big and was under the spot where I feed the fish has brought them out more. I think the movement of this plant in the slight current was disturbing them.

I've also made up some of Ladyred's Beefheart mix and this is slowly but surely being well received.

It is now getting to the point where there is some aggro when there is food added to the tank. Some fish are possessive/protective of where the food is. The Discus in my avatar will come in and grab what it can but is usually driven off.

The second dose of Prazi went in on Sun night and I will do water change Tue night. Will then put the UV back on Wed and put some carbon into the filter for a week or so to cleanse the tank.

[enigmatic]

Well I just thought I should add to the post after a few weeks to say that all appears to be going well.

The second dose of Prazi appears to have worked and the tank has had a few water changes and is running with carbon at present.

All Discus appear happy and feeding extremely well. All appear to be growing although some appear to be growing more than others but I think this is more to do with competition over food than any ailment.